Webinar The 1st OJK International Research Forum 2023

Otoritas Jasa Keuangan [ • ] Salman please welcome chairman of the Board of Commissioners of the Indonesia Financial Service Authority Mr Mahendra siregar and vice chairman of the Board of Commissioners of the Indonesia Financial Service Authority Mr Mirza Aditya suara [Applause] please rise now to begin our event on a patriotic note I kindly request everyone to sing

Our beloved Indonesian national anthem Thank you foreign [Applause] Okay James Put me down May you now be seated Foreign of the Board of Commissioners of the Indonesia Financial Service Authority Mr Mahendra siragar good morning Mahendra Vice chairman of the Board of Commissioners of the Indonesia Financial Service Authority Mr Mirza Aditya swara good morning director of prospera Mr David nailer good morning Mr David Deputy commissioners of the Board of

Commissioners and Logistics of the Indonesia Financial Services Authority Mr imansha good morning head of ojk Institute Mr agus sugiarto good morning distinguished speakers ladies and gentlemen welcome to the first ojk International Research Forum Save the Planet the role of financial sector to support carbon reduction and electric vehicles development thank you for your

Participation on today’s event for a theme of this firm reflects our commitment to addressing the most pricing issues facing our society and finding innovative solutions through research and inquiry I am Farah bahaswan master of ceremony for today’s event for your information there are 1520 people who registered to join this

Event online the majority comes from the banking sector 35 others 15 Insurance 9 financing eight percent academics nine percent Etc before we proceed to the next agenda allow me to run a quick brief of today’s event opening speech launching of the international Journal of financial systems presentation and panel

Discussion and wrap up and closing ladies and gentlemen next we will hear a comedy report and welcoming speech from the head of ojk Institute Mr agus sugiarto Mr aguso guerto this stage is yours Sorry excuse me The Honorable the chairman of professional Mahindra The Honorable Vice chairman of ojika Papa your Excellency Deputy Commissioner of secretary for the port and Logistics Mr David nailer director of Australia Indonesia partnership for economic development prospera good morning Mr Garvey and director of London Institute of banking Finance Singapore

Office good morning good morning the responsive of CPA Australia Jakarta office your Excellency speakers and my honorable guests the head of departments directors and officers of Utica director of banking sectors Capital Market and non-paying financial institution University professor and academics and all other distinguished cases Ladies and gentlemen it is an hour for me standing here to make my dream come true towards the first ojika International Research Forum in the year of 2023. this event will not have been possible we thought the infallible collaboration and support from our esteem Partners prospera the London is the topic in

Finance and CPA Australia together we have team up to bring the best expertise and resources from various background and countries to this Research Forum ladies and gentlemen has been established since 2013. whose roles are too regulate two supervised Financial sectors and to protect Financial customers with the new regulation what we call it

Omnipass law for financial sector or eska the role of ochika has been enhanced right now is not only regulating supervising and protecting but also developing this new rule of ojika under the Omnibus law for financial sector has motivated us to bring ojika as a center of excellence in financial sector and therefore

It is very afraid for us to have ochika international reset forum for the first time as there is Forum we are very delighted that we can invite various experts to the first forum which serve as a platform for knowledge exchanges and cooperation not only for tools who work in the financial sector

But also for the government Regulators policy makers and academics the team for this Research Forum is that how to save the planet we are what are the role of financial sectors to support corporate reduction and electric vehicle developments climate change becomes acid level Global challenge necessitating an education and

Coordinated action to mitigate its impact all of us has been acknowledged that the issue of the Net Zero carbon is well spread becoming an emerging topic anywhere cleverly and many International experts supported by the global Community as well as Global governments have a strong voice that

We have a big and long journey to achieve Net Zero carbon however we need to solve it and therefore we need to share the knowledge and information on how to reduce the carbon emission from researchers from precious people and academics we wish the research discussion of carbon reaction reduction will

Contribute follow us on how to make our planet stay blue and green forever secondly we also see that the issue of electric vehicles has been skyrocketed in the last decade this allows us to look into how to present see electric vehicles will benefit human as well as reducing carbon emission

We are very welcome to issue of electric vehicles discussed today in this forum and hopefully this topic will open a new horizon on how to financial sector can play a maximum role to support electric vehicle industry in addition the discussion of the discussion of electric vehicles will facilitate a

Seamless transition toward the aspect of electric vehicle adoption by examining those two emerging Trends it is very crucial for us to build a robust knowledge base the best to build a robust knowledge base Innovative strategies new regulatory Frameworks and actionable insight that will save Progressive policies and transformative practices ladies and gentlemen

We have structure the discussion today into two by four two important topics first possession in the morning we will discuss carpal reduction to shift the Next Generation and second session after lunch we will discuss electronic vehicle is our future this topic will be supported by many prominent speakers

For the first session we will have Dr Adam who will question about craziness of financial sector in supporting energy transition Dr Stanley yip who will present and deliver voluntary carbon Trading Market in Asia challenges and opportunities Dr John Fong is to simple Finance lead from climate work center Monash University who will

Deliver sustainable investing as a driver for the transition on the second discussion after lunch we will have miss Monica Juan who will discuss the consideration factors for the EV developments and Dr traffic Michelle who will deliver enabling infrastructure in the electronic vehicle ecosystem Mr suwane The Originals of non-paying financial

Sector to support if we financing industry in Indonesia ladies and gentlemen in at in addition to our stimulating session and discussion we are honored to announce the launch of the international Journal of financial system by the chairman and the vice chairman this academic Journal will serve as a distinguished platform for Scholars and

Experts to share their research findings academic Excellency as well as their knowledge in the array of financial system will show the role of ochika as a center of excellence with a low authentic research that has been done by ochika researchers to be accommodated the publication of decision now will

Also accommodate many Finance research from a diverse esteem academics from both home and overseas we appreciate the support and constructive cooperation from International and provincial accurate mission who have joined and team up with us as in the editorial team we wish this is only the beginning of the journal and hopefully

It will become one of the most valuable resources in financial system again thank you for the resource person who joined the actual team of the journal we have committed to continue the publication of the general and to hold the ojika international Forum periodically and consistently in the future

Ladies and gentlemen we have extended invitation to almost 250 participants attending today in this room representing fairies institutions including government Regulators state-owned Enterprise academics and practitioner in the financial system financial sector inspirational effort to obtain unique receptic ojika has invited Special 20 academic professors from University outside Java in Bali from western part

Of Indonesia and eastern part of Indonesia thank you for the University who already come here you are very proud test international supportum is not only intended by local partitions in this room in this building but also attended by person from overseas such as from UK Australia and other countries

The latest report I received this morning that more than 1500 1500 partitions who will work spiritually from anywhere from anywhere finally we hope that the anticipated outcomes of this forum are substantial which are enhancing knowledge opportunities challenges and network for all participants this option will undoubtedly contribute to the advancement of Student

Financial practices in the future last but not least is extended my highest gratitude to the port of consumer reports support the chairman and the vice chairman all the speakers all partners for the support and every one of you who are attending this Research Forum also my special gratitude to our College

Institute especially the group officials who have organized this event very well ladies and gentlemen thank you foreign to for your report and insightful speech next agenda we will hear some speech from the director of prospera David neller Mr devineller the stage is yours Good morning Papa Mahendra chair of rjk Music Vice Chair by imanta the head of the ojk Institute let me take the opportunity to congratulate ojk and the institute for this event and for the launch of the publication that you just outlined so it’s both my honor and pleasure to be with you today

To support this event through prospera to financial industry participants Regulators as well as academicians to discuss this really critical issue of the role of financial markets in driving sustainable investment to achieve a low-carbon transition so distinguished guests ladies and gentlemen I think the starting point is to recognize that this climate

Transition is really like no other policy challenge that we can recall um as an economist we’re good at examining where we are today doing diagnosis of the starting point and we have a pretty good idea also of where we’ve got to be what’s that Future Point or what does the destination look like

We know that that future destination has to be a sustainable one one that’s inclusive and that supports growth and job opportunities we ask what the path is between this starting point and this destination which are decades apart we’re starting to get into Uncharted Territory and that’s why this conference

Is so important to start to map out the steps that need to be taken so we’re about to you know enter a period of change which is comparable to the Industrial Revolution so a context which is very hard to conceptualize and very hard to analyze so it requires policy makers uh like the

Chair and vice chair of ojk to help that navigation and I think that’s why the Institute has a great role to play in helping to support those policy makers make these choices now while we may not have a GPS that tells us how to move step by step

Towards that destination I think we do know a few principles that guide us in that direction and I’ll let me name two or three of those principles the first one is that prices matter and that means that what we’re discussing today in terms of the carbon Market is a

Really foundational step in terms of bringing about the transition we want the carbon a carbon price to be developed which encourages all our activities to reflect the true cost economic cost of those activities not just the private costs and I’ll come back to this a little bit

Later in the sense that this is the topic of today the second principle I think is thinking about what people call a just transition and sure a just transition includes compensation for vulnerable groups that are impacted by change who unable to manage that on their own resources

But I think it’s actually much more than that and it’s about really building the social consensus without which these changes cannot happen the as I said before the change we’re looking at is so significant so substantial that if we don’t build that social consensus around what is a fair

Equitable transition it’s going to be very difficult to to realize that so we know change will happen question is will that change be the desirable change toward that sustainable destination the third principle I think to think about for Indonesia particularly is how to take full advantage how to maximize the use of Indonesia’s

Tremendous natural wealth this remains an untapped opportunity but as the price of carbon is rising day by day Indonesia’s resource the value monetary value of Indonesia’s resources is going up tremendously so the quest one question is how to realize that value through carbon Market in this case an offset Market as this

Thing from a compliance Market so the market would be developed based on the reduction or sequestration of carbon in one location in Indonesia to offset a carbon producing activity in another location and this would this would be a real driver of change positive change through the transition

Certainly a First Advantage is it will drive much stronger management of Indonesia’s natural Capital now Indonesia has about 125 million hectares of tropical forest to if there’s a price an evaluation of those forests in terms of sequestration the incentive to manage those goes up overnight and so this is a critical step

It also provides or can provide significant development Finance which as we all know is critical for the scale of investment required of the transition so I think for these reasons that that we want to sort of think about the role of carbon markets also not only

In the compliance sense but also in this other sense because we want this change to sustainability not just to be a burden it’s not about a choice between growth and employment versus sustainability we want to align those goals and the this is one way to do that because by

Creating value out of sequestration and so on will be encouraging investment in clean energy carbon capture waste management and so on and so forth so it’s the creation of value that’s recognized once we have a price on carbon through this method so these are all principles I think

Which can we can think about in terms of developing carbon transition in Indonesia So today we’re focusing on the first of these issues or principles around the price of carbon so we’re looking at the role of a carbon Market a cap and trade market for compliance

And it’s this is to me is a really significant step um and you know I want to congratulate again ojk for leading on this work um and uh and for sort of moving moving the moving the dial on this topic which has been talked about for some time

One of the advantages of this carbon Market is that it allows the government to determine the specific emission Target and the path of that Target over time and I think this is important because we don’t want a situation where we jack up a carbon price to a high level overnight we cause economic

Disruption stranded Assets in the financial sector and so on and so forth this has to be done in a gradual manner so that and with Clarity and transparency that business and the financial sector know the path that’s coming so there’s not an urgency that we have to do everything today but it’s a

Pathway Which business can be guided by uh in moving forward so these these elements of the market are all practical ones that I think we can think about um as in terms of shaping the mapping so finally I guess just to note there’s still of course much to do and so the

Agenda for the Institute is Big we’ve got to think about extending the the compliance Market beyond the power plants that are already going to be included and that involves a lot of investment in infrastructure particularly mrv and standards and so forth we need to think about comparability and alignment of different

Approaches including globally so we can reduce the transaction cost of participating in the market and enhance transparency and so forth so in closing I think this is a really pivotal juncture in in our transition so I hope that 20 years from now we can look back and we can say that the

Establishment of the carbon Market by ojk in September 2023 was a critical first step toward a sustainable and opportunity creating transition for the Indonesian people so thank you and congratulations to ojk [Applause] thank you Mr David nailer for your speech moving on the next agenda it’s now time

For our keynote speaker please join me in welcoming Mr Mahendra srega the chairman of the Indonesia Financial Services Authority to this stage Mr Mahendra srega the floor is yours I I didn’t notice earlier David when we had the national anthem in Indonesia whether you sang along with us of the song Indonesia or it was the God defend New Zealand I didn’t know but in any case your your presence today and other colleagues are the testimony of your commitment for the development

The effort and the contribution that Indonesia is now undertaking to be part of the responsible Global citizen assalamu alaikum warahmatullahi very good morning to all of you and then David nailer imagine Colleagues distinguished speakers and moderators all participants ladies and gentlemen a warm welcome to all of you present today also to all of you who join this forum through virtual online access first of all I wish to take this opportunity to thank our colleagues from prospera from other partners including the

London Institute of banking and finance and also from the CPA Australia John and also from the WWF Asia Pacific organization and of course to ojk Institute to make this event possible and it is certainly my great pleasure uh to join all of you today for the first Research Forum International Research

Forum with the team Save the Planet the role of financial sector to support carbon reduction and electric vehicle development on a general level the promotion of research is essential and in many respects pivotal for the overall development of our societies the lack of research capacity has in many ways held back

Developing and emerging countries that as a consequence have generally follow innovation and research outcome in products and Concepts and IDs from the most advanced economies and necessary and as a result we have not been at the Leading Edge of Technology nor generating IDs to contribute to molding a future for our next generation

The commitment to developing research and development and innovation is not only essential to addressing environmental challenges but it also an essential tool to delivering long-term economic and social prosperity without which we will not be able to effectively address climate change and meet the UN sustainable development goals at the same time

As an example the palm oil industry in Indonesia continues to research and develop new strains of palm seeds to increase productivity this not only contributes to economic and social welfare especially for smallholders but it also assists in the protecting the global Land Bank which is very limited by meeting the ever increasing demand

For festival oils and on a limited and even lesser land as Indonesia transitions to a more developed economy research capabilities within both the public and private sectors continues to increase and we recognize that the benefits far outweigh the costs while there is naturally a competitive element to research and innovation

We should seek to collaborate as much as possible at least at the level of pre-competitive research to share these benefits dear colleagues ladies and gentlemen research Innovation and bringing products and ideas to the market cannot be realized without adequate financing targeted financing can also encourage the development of the sustainable

Economy that combines climate change commitments without undermining economic and social progress ojk seeks to gear the financial sector to meeting the commitments of the government of Indonesia notably the Paris agreement and new U.N sustainable development goals in this respect there are several tools available to ojk to assist in this process to include

First since 2015 ojk has issued sustainable financing roadmaps with the objectives of building Awareness on sustainable Finance and it has been expanded to establish an ecosystem for sustainable financing expanding the supply and demand for environmentally friendly funds and increasing the sustainable Finance implementation in the financial services industry

Second the issuance of the national green taxonomy as a comprehensive guide for users to a certain extent this taxonomy draws on globally developed models which has to include asean taxonomy for sustainable Finance version 2 which has just been issued in the last semester however we believe that green taxonomy

Should be increasingly oriented to the financing of entities that promote and Implement policies that meet sdg’s goals this third business matching or networking by facilitating discussions and businesses exchanges between green project owners and potential financials in order to encourage greater financing and investment in these sectors through these exchanges we would also

Hope to encourage the pooling of resources for pre-competitive research foreign ojk has also launched several incentives in the area of green Bond issuance and financing for electric vehicle ecosystems and has continually undertaken International collaboration between stakeholders including actively contributing to numerous standard setting bodies to include the financial stability board

The basal committee for banking supervision as well as the network of central banks and supervisors for Greening the financial system fifth to further support emission reductions efforts ojk has launched a carbon trading framework and regulation or JK regulation for the carbon exchange trading system has just recently launched last month

And the exchange is expected to be launched tomorrow by the president in the morning this exchange is extended is intended to provide a market mechanism that will help support the government and disease while balancing out a gradual and smooth transition towards a sustainable economy that does not result in the industrialization

Dear speakers moderator there is gentlemen the importance I attach to the sdgs 2030 is based largely on developments being witnessed in developed countries where the process of risk of the industrialization is resulting in economic and social stability and this in turn is undermining commitments made in terms of these

Countries or not on net zero emissions and not to mention the erosion of progress on wider sdg goals several examples of governments and countries that have now undertaken a very extreme route and actually to a certain extent you turn in their commitment for Net Zero and renewable energy development

It is essential that energy needs in a transitioning economy there are men it is unrealistic to expect that renewable energies can replace fossil fuels in the short term as infrastructure is lacking an inability to deliver required load factors technologies that often require high level of capital with low productivity

And an absence of financing as a result several coal plants are being reopened in Europe there is a lack of financing for green projects that are not profitable and in the case of electric cars even the UK prime minister just announced a major shift in green policies to include delaying the Banning

Of petrol based cars on the basis that British families should not be expected to shoulder unacceptable costs in order for Indonesia to continue to progress the green economy we need to research more carefully the balance needed and time required in a transitioning process and we need to focus on evidence-based research

For example the electric car industry depends on mining of essential minerals and car charging points mostly rely on electricity from fossil fuels as most high cost Alternatives would significantly impede the development of electric cars in this respect targeted financing should include upstream and downstream processes we can reward mining that delivers on

Sdgs and also provide support for Downstream Industries we need to ensure that the sustainable economy being developed in Indonesia in is based on bankable investments we need to be judicious on the choice of renewable energies for example there is a growing concern that when energy is perhaps not a viable source

High investment low productivity requiring considerable subsidy it may still be viable in certain regions of Indonesia but this certainly require more research ladies gentlemen I raise these issues because ultimately economic growth underpins social stability and these two pillars are prerequisites for meeting climate change commitments we must strip away narratives and

Rhetorics and see the reality as it is in order to achieve a real sustainable economy and meet sustainable commitments made evidence and factual based research are critical are Essentials in this context Indonesia is on a good path we are already well on the way as earlier David Naylor mentioned

To meeting the Paris agreement through our ability to improve the natural Capital base carbon emission reduction unlike many other countries in the world 60 percent of Indonesia’s carbon emission come from forestry and land use sector and on that note Indonesia is very much on track to achieve not just Net Zero but even

Net sync forestry and land use sector by 2030. and that is the commitment very much underway and there is also will enrich Indonesia carbon Exchange which could be one of the very few if not unique in the world which can offer so much variety diversification of carbon units from natural capital energy base

From compliance or offset markup ladies and gentlemen I have expressed dispute IDs and I hope this forum provides the opportunity to learn from the experience and exchange information Among Us personally or virtually to keep updated the latest in sustainability research particularly in electric vehicle ecosystem and carbon emission reduction and of course the

Best practices regionally and globally thank you for being here today and this is best wishes to all of us I look forward to a productive and engaging discussion thank you very much for your valuable speech but stay on stage and allow me to invite Mr Mirza Mr

Iman Shah and Mr agu sugiarto to the stage ladies and gentlemen we are now ready to launch an important Initiative for the official launch of the international Journal of financial systems Mr Mahindra Mr Mirza Mr imansha and Mr agus please proceed with the launch please kindly press the button together

On my count three two one please give big round of applause Everybody yeah the international Journal of financial systems or ijfs is expected to serve as a platform for the publication and dissemination of research findings conducted by both internal and external parties of the ojk furthermore igfs will also enrich the treasury and insight into understanding economic and financial topics from various perspectives gather policy

Recommendations based on comprehensive and structure scientific studies and contributes to the advancement of knowledge in the field of economics and violence igfs has launched once again please give big round of applause and let’s capture this moment of significance we invite all our distinguished speakers to despair to the stage

To join us for a group Association please foreign ERS will guide us please follow their instructions or in my instruction on my count three two one give the best smiles okay once again three two one thank you and ladies and gentlemen please kindly watching igfs video yeah please kindly watching igfs video

Market Recreation and instruments they evacuated the efficient allocation of resources waste management and economic growth the development of financial system is an ongoing process influenced by Myriad of factor including the technological advancement regulatory Frameworks and changing Market tell me over time private seal system fe4 from traditional localized models to globalize technology

To travel ecosystem profession such as digital banking mobile payment blockchain Technology Insurance technology and algorithmic trading have frequency nice financial transaction when shaping the landscape or financial system research on financial system home is important as it explore the detail and complexities associated with this system by examining very expensive satisfaction

Institution Market instrument regulatory Frameworks and risk management practices researchers contribute to our understanding of how Financial system function that efficiency and their stability recognizing this imperative the Financial Services Authority subsequently inaugurated the international Journal of financial system abbreviated as igrs this journal is expected to serve as a platform for

The publication and dissemination of research finding conducted by both internal and external parties of the otk furthermore igfs will also end with drizzling and insight into understanding economy and financial topic for various perspectives get the policy recommendation based on comprehensive and structure scientific studies and contribute to the advancement of

Knowledge in the field of Economic and finance will be able to become repeatable International Journal serving as a scholarly reference for Academia policy making and best practices within financial industry OG can probably present Please welcome the international Journal of financial system the source of inspiration and innovation of the financial system development Journal of financial system nurturing progress in financial system International Journal of financial systems and Mr Mahendra and Mr Mirza are welcome to leave the event thank you foreign At this juncture I would like to delegate the session to our moderator arishi Ras sambunan who will facilitate a presentation and panel discussion with our distinguished speakers please take it from here Good morning ladies and gentlemen honorable gas this thing is speakers are welcome to all so my name is Larissa Ross and I’m honored to be the moderator of this morning session which is on uh the role of carbon emission reduction and to save our next generation

So to warm up a bit before we start our panel discussion I would like to invite you to join a mini game so there’s this mentimeter that should show up on the screen right now so you can use your mobile phone and try to visit the link

And input the code so there’s gonna be some questions uh shown on the screen and then you can try to answer some questions and try to you know uh dig a bit further and to see how deep or understanding about sustainable finance and carbon emission so I think the mini-meanors should show up

In a bit so yeah uh so you can try to there’s uh the QR code if you can scan the code or just uh go to the the link and enter the code and then you can just start answering the question the first one is what do you know about carbon emissions

I think we already have about six almost 40 respondents right now yeah more responses are coming up we should be able to see the results so as you can see from the uh the music the moving craft there carbon emissions are most often associated with pollution CO2 greenhouse gases and I think uh

This is what most of us know about what carbon emission is carbon dioxide yes so uh more reasonable comment and I think and I think that shows you know uh how how familiar people are with with carbon emission and hopefully uh from today’s discussion uh in the morning which is about carbon

Emission reduction and later about the role of electric vehicle in reducing uh carbon emission we will be able to understand more about the challenges and the opportunities uh faced by this new growing industry so I think this is yeah I think I think this is the uh the final results

That we have I don’t think it’s Gonna Change much so thank you very much for uh participating in this small uh game and without further review I would like to start the uh the panel discussion so uh for participants in the venue you’ll be able to ask questions later during the Q a

Session and for online participants uh please feel free to uh input your question through the uh your Zoom app um Now we move on to our first presentation type session the topic is on carbon reduction to save the Next Generation we are fortunate enough to have three esteem speakers who will share the

Expertise with us the first one is Dr Stanley a young Professor Energy Research Institute nanyang Technological University Dr you please can come forward so the SEC the second one we have Dr Adam Ang GFR Asia Pacific lead and sustainable Finance advisor from WWF Malaysia and last but not least we have Dr John

Vong Adjunct professor master of public policy and management at Monastery University Indonesia and also sustainable Finance consultant for various International organizations such as the World Bank undp as well as Asia Development Bank so thank you very much for coming to Indonesia and to share your knowledge and expertise with us this morning

So it’s uh its speaker will have 20 minutes for the presentation and then later we have a moderation and finally q and a session so first of all I will invite Dr Stanley Yip to provide to present his presentation is a junk professor at the NTU he’s the

Co-founder at Nan rice which is a spin-off company from the NTU and he has he’s an economist and urban planner with more 30 years experience in various countries such as China Hong Kong Taiwan and various Southeast Asian countries and he received his PhD from Peking University Dr Yip the floor is yours

Say next I think I think they can hear can you hear okay first of all thanks a lot for the opportunity to come to the this morning so JK Institute forum and uh I have a presentation which I want to summarize a bit of artwork that relate to the

Voluntary current markets in Asia particularly Okay so let me use this through my the PowerPoint okay the presentation I’m going to Super forward actually is based on a lot of the very recent data and also a lot of work done either through other bodies or

By our institutes in NTU we do a lot of resource work particularly myself on carbon markets particularly the challenges and also the restrictions and opportunities for Asia so what we want to do is based on the work that we’ve done our landrise company which is a

Spin-off from NTU and also we are housed in the Energy Resource Institute in NTU we do a lot of well-related decarbonization in Asia and particularly on technology on data and or Camp Finance so we entrepreneur myself a lot of experience in the developing carbon voluntary Market projects and that’s

What I want to share with you today a lot of the challenges and opportunities ahead so first of all I would like to actually go through very quickly about where we are in terms of the global one to recovery markets there are not enough resources work done so far but we still

Can have a very good understanding of where we are stating at in terms of voluntary markets uh it all comes back to the gold the red Noble goal that eventually the whole world need to reach a next zero emission status by 2050 and that drives everybody including organizations companies individuals and

Governments to actually do whatever they would they need to to reach that goal eventually by 2050 of a net zero and the financial sector is very important in this the major activities and driver for this pathway including mitigation including carbon offset including investment into future technology current removal all need to support our

Financial sector there’s no way that we can actually do this on our own without the capital without the banking center before financial center but the offset Market which we’ll talk about today in terms of voluntary cover Market is very important from now all the way entry twice 2050. before the offset it’s very

Difficult to finance a lot of the possible possible mitigation possible project at a very stage So based on that role let’s look at where we are if you take the very recent research report produced by the the research institute looking at how much money are now being invested into current credit project on

A voluntary Market over the last 10 15 years we can CH a very specific growth of the amount of money being actually invested in carbon quality projects particularly over the last five years the whole Market actually have started being becoming very steadily very sort of threat balance since 2012 and 2017

And then from 17 onwards but then over the last five years there’s a very sharp rise in terms of the money raised so today we actually see more and more money going into they want three carbon markets projects financial sector and investor putting money to remove the carbon dioxide emission from the

Atmosphere through the voluntary Market projects but if you get carefully in by the end of 2023 a lot of those money raised for the warranty cabin markets are actually still around the what we call the agriculture land and land use uh uh sector basically in terms of nature restoration Forest protection

And also in terms of the culture the green setup it takes more than 60 percent of all the investment there are other sectors in terms of renewable energy Energy Efficiency carbon engineering are taking the rest but the predominant amount of money going into this Market are still related to whoever

Have the right to do something about the agriculture practices Land Management and also the forestry as of today the area covered by this kind of project is almost like the area of the whole Italy today not enough obviously but it’s growing very fast but one thing we need

To know on where we are is over the last 12 years or 10 years or so money are going into all this area but if you look ahead our money already being put together estimated for the future next to several years there’s a start to grow over money

Going into what we call the carbon removal project by technology this is actually an emerging not yet mature but giving a lot of promises to a lot of people that we have to rely on the direct removal of carbon dioxide and LSP through technology so you can see the

Black sector there indicate the growth of importance of that kind of investment but still the green the land use forestry agriculture is dominating that market I’ll come back to that point later on because there’s a lot of challenges and there’s a lot of opportunity behind that

We do also a little bit of research on once we know that there are money going into this Market but what are the key determinants of what project to be invested in and where the Financial Centers should be looking in so we look at five or six of the major what we call

The international standard bodies in this world basically looking at who are the international sustainabilities setting the standards qualifying of this project worth generating the credits and who are actually providing a methodologies so that project can actually compile with a certain standard certain way or quantification that is very important because you need the

International recognition and Independence independent transparency on what your port is all about no question asked the largest independent standard today being used by most projects is the project standard used by wearer we all know about that actually majority of the internationally transcended volunteering credits are actually issued but whatever

VCS so and followed by the gold standard and the rest and they’re more and more and more than this but if you look me look at this look at the market what’s the status of the market let’s look at what the world VCS projects look like then we probably have a very good

Understanding of what it would be Bobby like for us so we actually did a lot of research work into what the world research project are composed of so if you look at we look at all these major International standard bodies in terms of the common credits they have issued basically they have registered

Project and they issued a credit so the credit can be transacted internationally there’s tremendous rise in the number of the credit issued and also redeemed since 2017. so before 2017 is a very flat curve is it’s happening it was at doing a lot of things we all know it

Exists but it’s not generating a lot of impact the interest actually basically came up about five years ago and it’s growing very fast both in terms of the number of credit issued in terms of tons of companies emission and also the number credit Redeemed by the ultimate

User who has to use that to offset their emission that growth is the reason why we’re here today looking at that growth what is the opportunity and what are the challenges for the Asian market so the next thing I want to talk about very quickly is what

Are these projects if you look Comfort zero into Asia because what we have known so far is the global situation it’s quite different you look at the Asian market we if you look at Asian market where these carbon Credit Unions under the research system are issued for project in the location

Majority of them are today is dominated by two countries a project in India and China with a real quick grow high growth high-speed growth for the rest of Asia including Vietnam Thailand of course Indonesia but still 63 percent of them of the whole Global actually uh credit

Issue by VCS are actually issue in Asia Asia is the local market Asia is a future of the world record Market in the world let’s be clear about that so whatever we do here in Indonesia in Asia we’re going to generate a lot of impact on this Market globally the activities

And focus is here and will be here but if you look at what kind of project we are talking about in terms of the credit generated majority of them are actually on energy renewable energy but don’t get misinterpreted by this graph because a lot of the energy renewable energy

Projects like wind solar were actually the early stage project as you issued more than 10 years ago today large-scale renewable energy project actually coming down in number because it’s no longer regarded as a priority for the standard body what is coming up is on land use on agriculture on Waste Management

If you look at the project resistor number 40 resistor we can see that well what are this worth I mean it’s very important to look at the market side project side from investment perspective so we go through all the project with the nvcs in terms of the annual amount of carbon dioxide tonnage

That you can generate every year to look at what what is the size of one single project majority of the project we’re talking about for between 10 to 100 000 tons a year and then a large number of them actually within this range then we come down to maybe a bit more than

That if we go up up to 1 million it’s a very very rare now let’s look at this and don’t be misled by this graph the reasons why majority of the project they generate 10 to 12 100 000 tons a year is because they actually feed into methodologies in our research

We found out that there are many many many projects is smaller than ten thousand per but they could not get into the system because they’re too small but because they’re too small that’s not being said they’re not contributing on an aggregate basis to government emission if we have way to actually help

The small projects to be grouped together again that will open up a lot of opportunities that is what the Asian market actually have a lot of opportunity because we have a lot of the consumer side demand side project small motors in size but in aggregate they’re

Huge in terms of potential impact but we do not have the right vehicle or platform to help them to educate so a lot of the activities are continued on the high side but I don’t think we should actually missing out opportunity on a small project so opportunity and

Challenges let’s look at what are the opportunities for more VC in terms of research we know that predominant among a number of credit in the Water Market is actually in Asia the market is Asia the fact is supplying those projects supplying those offsets in Asia but Asia has a very

Unique Pathway to Net Zero 2015. very different from the pathway of the Western Country European Country Bank Country our economy system our governance our policy our industry structure are very different even in the same sector then what’s happening in the same industry for some in Europe or in

America but Asia particularly in terms of our growth you look at our Urban organization majority of the mega cities population growth organization is going to happen in Asia over the next 20 50 30 years so we are on a very different pathway and that means the

Amount the not the amount of credits the project the investment the demand and supply side would not be as the same if you look at what’s happening over the last 10 15 years in June it’s very very much different so we need to develop and

Try to push what we call an Asian model for one Club encrypted we look at what are the opportunities for growth in terms of the interest in the market that through our clients through the project I work with across Asia and also through our network of NGO and banking we realize that they’re

Actually a free driver for the Asian market number one the continue urbanization Urban growth infrastructure and population growth what you carry on in Asia for a long time and that will drive construction energy Demand on a demand side Energy Efficiency and also on a lot of infrastructure the second

Drivable growth in Asia is we are basically in Asia still a very resource-based economy and particularly India and Indonesia Vietnam asean and even China we really resource base so resource pay project that would become the dominant supplier of the market and that means Waste Management agriculture forestry livestock all this will become

A very major sector in this market and also I put in technological innovation because I mentioned an upcoming aspect of growth is actually on technology your cabin capture Asia god of the land or the possibility of all these so carbon capture and storage are key so if you

Look at that and look back at what are the methodology currently available we see that there are major Gap there there are some managed demand there’s some on transport on the demand side but a lot of the upcoming Asian uh specific economy structure based methodology and not even developed not yet actually

Exists we verify this by looking at several projects we are working on a project for the whole industrial power and potential business district in China there’s no methodology today actually we look at one Urban District as one entity we have athology on building individual buildings by individual building as you

Would generally very small number of tonnage of carbon dioxide emission reduction every year by combining everything within one Urban district one Utah the impact is huge but we don’t have methodology International for that we are experimenting that with a couple of Chinese government cities on actually aggregating all the carbon dioxide

Emissions within the urban District into one single project we need Break Free in that we also work with of course cultivation of coffee in Vietnam which we need Land Management and also I think a very important sector up growing is a waste management particularly from animal waste you’ll be quite surprised

By the among the number of carbon dioxide emissions generated by this setup is huge it’s comparable in certain aspects to actually to the forestry and agricultural Etc the animal waste is a very important sector that we can actually generate a lot of financial interest for investment since 2010 and 11 when the voluntary

Markets start to grow such established their originally there’s a large number of Mythology being released but over the last 10-15 years every year we only have one or two little doji added to that the number of methodology added to this system are not catching up with the

Demand of new technology and also new projects we need more Innovation more resources to develop a set of more methodology particularly for Asia we are not we are lagging behind and time is taking so we should not wait for the for the existing organization to deliver the methodology we need to actually have

More methodology one key thing I really want to say here and using this platform is through our own experience when we’re applying methodology and standard for some by wearable or gold standard or CDM on some project in Asia we realize that because of the unique database you need information system governance and

Infrastructure in Asia it’s very difficult to use some of the methodology although they are on the same setup they talk about same kind of activities but when we try The Benchmark on some of the data we could not do it easily so it’s not fascinating us we need a regional

Based methodology that are tailor-made for actually Asia to facilitate and enhance and size fast speed the growth of that so the other concern obviously in terms of challenges is large-scale deforestation or culture related project recently over the last one year or so I’ve been challenged by a lot of green group and

Media there are a lot of big hot debate you know it very well between guardian and also with the authority of the standard bodies they are also debate on what is true what is not true what is scientific what is not scientific what’s the impact I believe that there we need

Actually a more participation and support by the governments not really to regulate this Market but in terms of providing data and resource and research to actually make the transparency of the impact in a more objective way let’s let’s get away from all the argument on the journalistic aspect let’s go into

Data and hard data I think it’s very important that and we don’t have good database sometimes to explain the fact whether a certain projects actually have the real impact they promise and if you look at transition costs I thought already actually majority of the project are fall within 10 000 to

100 000 tons a year for those projects sometimes they could not affect the expensive transaction costs associated with the cost in terms of the consultancy cost the registering cost the investment cost to take them all the way through the process we need way to actually reduce as much as possible the

Transaction cost the reduction cost depends very much on how transparent and how sophisticated and mature the whole industry look like and honestly today the volunteer cover Market itself is not 100 sophisticated enough to make transaction smooth and transparent so we need to do something about it and then

Finally in order to look at what is ahead of us I think we need to create the uncertainties in terms of HFA solution in four-way nature-based Solutions are very important particularly for countries like Indonesia and also in China Agriculture in terms of Forestry in terms of the

Protection of the ecology in the blue carbon but over the whole process of taking a major large-scale land research concession from from State one stage one all the way to the market there are a lot of uncertainty and risk like any project or investment investment into this sector particularly have to look at

Four risk one the capacity of natural processes natural processes is not like Energy Efficiency for building there are a lot of uncertainty ahead that need to be managed and de-risk we can calculate the efficiency of a building energy Vision system easily with a lot of data but it’s very difficult sometimes to

Verify the actually the carbon dioxide emission as we can actually be reduced for natural processes their way to do it but they’re also uncertainty in Risk the second risk we need to do cover is the permanency of the store carbon is the project permanent if we are actually

Crediting a project for 40 years what’s going to happen in 10 years time so we need a better sort of facilitation and also management of that process by the insurance industry by the government in terms of setting up standard and by by protection and also Severance we need consistency of the social impact

Generated by this project and also a very clear understanding of attentionality and the added value of those projects finally for the last minute I have several key suggestions that we need to look at and also subjected to uh the research institute for any any possible way one we need to

Think about developing of asian-based regional standard and sistorical roadmap for the voluntary Common Market not created from zero based but consolidating was already there globally but developed footing a framework that’s suitable for the Asian economy through for our industry for the same culture same forestry same Waste Management we

Have our own practices and economic structure and our own database we need that with time it’s actually very limited from now to 2015. we need to actually speed up and enhance Asian market on our own not relying only on The American or european base center today that we use secondly speed up the

Focus on what we are good at so that with select specific Setter to focus on or particularly on fitting the urbanization fitting the economy fitting our industry structure thirdly we need to provide and grow the growth in the professionalism we need to actually have the verification the standard the

Knowledge base take it up to one higher level for people in this area from the Violence Center from environment Factor will understand more clearly about the signs and the data and objectivity for all these things it’s not a guesswork it’s all about science and then finally building the risking measure

Particularly for nature-based solution because we need to actually control and manage the risk I think the insurance company and the risk management professionals have a lot to contribute today into this but they are not there yet honestly they’re not really into this part of the financial system yet

And finally we need transparency on data and good quality project so we all benefit from it thank you very much thank you very much foreign has a huge opportunity for vcm but some challenges it exist such as credibility uh Innovations as well as issues related to carbon

Carbon offset methodology and I can see that Indonesia is lagging its smaller neighbors such as Thailand and Vietnam so hopefully we can catch up in the near future thank you very much once again so next I would like to invite Dr Adam so I think on the screen

You can see the brief CP of Dr adamant So Dr Adam Ang is the Asia Pacific lead of gfri WWF Malaysia he previously has held various professional and academic positions such as the postdoctoral research fellow at the Oxford University and he earned his PhD from ncf Malaysia so uh please present your presentation thank you hello uh moderator but Iris Um so thank you very much for prospera for inviting uh to join the esteemed speakers and um this is my second time in Jakarta in within one week um so I was playing to Play the soundtrack but I think most of you would have known this uh anyone have seen this movie

Yeah so it’s the famous Tom Cruise and um so what’s the mission possible why it was because it was a movie right yeah yeah but I think more importantly it was successful because there was a number of trial and error but on top of that he had a parachute and a lot of

Safety net so I think that that is a testimony in terms of how the countries and Industry could also transit or Transit transition because you need a lot of trial and error and more importantly you need to have the law persistent and perseverance right of course with a lot of safety net

Um so today I will focus on making it a mission possible and the focus here is on financing energy transition this is a chart from the Boston Consulting Group that was recently published and it shows that the transition to Net Zero needs to happen roughly three times faster than previous

Transitions so if you look at the turning point from the industry Revolution the call share from 1950s have gone up to 50 55 percent by the 20th century and this was followed by a massive increase of oil transition but from now towards 2050 there’s a need to increase by not just three times

Faster but if you look at the pace and the volume it has to reach 70 of renewable share by 2050. so this is a massive increase because currently we are only at 12 and there’s a lot of global efforts and Synergy that’s needed to transition

If you look at the risks so that other countries or institutions have map the European Central Bank has recently done the climate stress test and they found that Eurozone Banks face more than 100 increase in credit risks by 2030 if climate transition is delayed and this is with an estimated absolute

Annual losses of about 21 billion under late push scenario in 2029 so usually climate stress test looks into a longer Horizon up to 2050 but what the ECB has done for this round of stress test exercise is that they’re front loaded the transition so there are three transition scenarios and this is

One of the the many scenarios they have also found that on average companies and firms profitability will decrease by two to three percent and this is two times more severe in the case of energy intensive sectors so this includes the likes of Mining and Manufacturing

But at the same time while there are a lot of risks there is also a lot of challenges as well especially for developing countries so high cost of capital if you look at the wwacc or the bottom if you can see that many countries including Indonesia Mexico Pakistan Nigeria has relatively

High wacc the cost of capital is almost 10 percent compared to more advanced countries like the US and Germany which is in the single digit at the same time this country like the U.S and Germany could have wider or larger government spending as percentage of the GDP because they

Have also lower Capital uh cost of capital so the good news good news is that Indonesia as per the speeches by the esteemed speaker earlier it’s enhancing policy efforts to reduce co-dependence but at the same time the countries also have facing headwinds in Just Energy transition

As I think what was mentioned by the chairman audrika that there’s also a lack of bankable climate projects that is now affecting the energy transition but on the flip side there’s also good news from the news that I’ve read that apparently there are quite a number of

Forums this this forum was uh this this month in Jakarta where there was a news that Singapore is also importing renewable energy from Indonesia within five years and this is up to two gigawatt and I think a couple of companies from Indonesia has been identified as the supply of renewable

Energy this is a good news because it propels Indonesia as a potential Regional Marketplace player there’s a lot of initiative towards having an asean Greek whereby countries like Malaysia Thailand Singapore Indonesia could be connected to be the next asean Powerhouse so now the question is with these challenges risks initiatives

Is transition even possible if you look at offset which is a Danish utility company it started off with coal in 20 as there was no longer known as the dong energy and in 20 20 in 20 sorry in 2008 the business model was primarily centered on coal

So 85 they had this 85 15 Vision whereby back in 2008 85 of their business model and revenue were generated primarily from coal and only 15 from Renewables so this 85 15 ratio or version was to set a Target that the next 20 30 years from 20

To 2008 to co to invert the ratio so that they achieve 85 percent of Renewables and only 15 of code the good news is that this Danish utility company had achieved this transition way earlier so you can look at the chart in 2012 for example oil and

Gas and other fossil fuel was the majority of his accounts whereby five years later in 2017 you can see that it’s it’s all 100 onshore offshore win and there’s a there’s also a projection of that this will increase and going forward of course if you read

The news recently in the US I think this company has also faced a lot of challenges um one reason was because interest rate issues that affects Supply chains and they are now modeling over uh how to kind of navigate the the U.S business and the politics when it comes to supply

Chain uh disruption um this has also been translated into dollars and Cent if you look at um the the price change from the of the stock from 2016 to 2021 or stack share price have gone up tremendously and you can see that the fousey 100 companies as

Well as the big all the companies like shell remain quite constant right so coming back to what actions that regulators and financial institutions could take at WWF we have this annual suspect sustainable Financial regulation and Central Bank activities tracker this year is the third year assessment and we

Track up to 44 Financial Regulators supervisor central banks around the world and to see how they integrate climate environment environment and social considerations into their mandate and practices some of these uh some of the good practices that we have seen of course there needs to be some some form of

Contextualization to the local context recently belonged to France in in the Central Bank of France have announced exclusion of fossil fuel extraction from his portfolio by end 2024. and they are at the same time they are stepping up efforts to align all its Equity components within a 1.5 Celsius

Trajectory by end 2025. so when Bank to front started this journey they didn’t go straight to 2.0 sorry 1.5 Celsius trajectory they actually started with a 2.2 Celsius trajectory and then slowly step up their their commitments to to be more astringent our neighboring country in Singapore the monetary monetary authority of Singapore

Has also launched a finance for Net Zero action plan and not just focusing on green Finance but also to include transition finance and to make Transition Finance possible there’s also a list of of building blocks such as transition plans credible transition plans that the Mas has announced and will be publishing soon as

Well as scaling up Green Tech Solutions and these Green Tech Solutions will rely on things such as data and disclosure in China The People’s Bank of China has also launched a 41 billion US Dollars re-lending programs to incentivize Banks to allocate more loans to green projects and this will will not just incentivize

The the kind of projects at the project level but also it will promote more information disclosure and in Malaysia the Central Bank of Malaysia Bank Malaysia has also launched a couple of years ago a low carbon transition facility in the the region of 400 million US Dollars the aim of this

Transit the facility is to support small medium Enterprises in adopting sustainable and low carbon prices this form served as a form of subsidy or incentive to kind of crowd in private financial institution to kind of support the transition and again in Singapore there’s also this convergence institution whereby they

Have a multi-donor funding window for climate Finance solution and the first round of funding was from the Mas the Australian Department of Foreign Affairs and trade olayan group and UBS Optimus Foundation although the amount is relatively small but they serve to capture you know the the funding stage at the early stage

Before it goes up into the VC PE and also a large Corp level at the same time we also have this annual assessment at WWF looking to the banking performance in asean as well as Korea and Japan so last year this this of course this assessment will be out the 2023 Edition

Will be out end of this year so this result is a bit dated but if you look at the trend um Singapore Japan Korea are the top three in terms of improvement there has been a lot of improvement in terms of if you look at the blue chart whereby those

Are the progress made in 2022 and as compared to 2021 in the green chart but most of the other countries that Malaysia Thailand Indonesia Vietnam Philippines are relatively low these are below 25 of all the indicators of the focus on energy that has been achieved and when we cut across more detail in

Terms of what aspects of the indicators that should be focused on the conclusion is that Banks should then set targets and these targets should be science-based credible robust and of course transparent to show how they will transit or transition their energy portfolio a lot of banks have sector approach

They’re more than 50 so sectoral approach in a broader sense is easier they have also started to have a bit more disclosure and monitoring but when it goes down to the individual verticals within the fossil fuel industry like coal oil and gas and cross-cutting there’s lack of initiative and disclosure in those area

We also look into asset managers and these were assessment done by our colleagues from WWF Singapore and the conclusion is that asset managers should proactively engage investing companies to influence the alignment to Paris agreement the charts is a bit small but if I can conclude here in terms We compare

Between the European asset managers and the Asian asset managers most of the European asset managers have publicly disclosed their jsg emission they’ve also set jsg emission reduction targets and also publish the tcft report and adopted science-based targets focusing on energy sectors um however Asian in the Asian context

Says very few I think there’s only one out of many of the asset managers that will assessed they have all these four components um the more challenging Parts uh even faced by the European asset managers um the one in the bottom whereby the commitment to the commission or rehabilitate the natural environment

This is also unseen or not seen the case of the Asian context um just to kind of stop oil gas producer from expanding into oil and gas field again there’s only one in the European context and to expect oil and gas producer to Transit into Renewables again this is only one

So now what banks could do in in the context of Malaysia and asean CMB is the fifth largest banking group Financial Group in the asean context this there’s also this program known as green beasts ready amounting to 640 million USD for sustainability link financing for the smes

And the initiative here is to propel or to prompt smes to achieve emission reduction targets via financing rebates so up to 0.5 percent per annum this serves as an incentive right at the same time I think the challenges that smes are facing is that how do you even

Calculate how do you verify and collect data so the the bank also provide training and advisory services to support smes in to achieve their target and also to kind of do the matchmaking I think the OJ car chairman has also mentioned about business matchmaking so supplier matchmaking to enable smes to

Not just calculate and reduce but to actually transform their businesses in the context of Singapore DBS was the first bank in Singapore to commit to The Net Zero banking Alliance as part of the the G funds they were also the first in Southeast Asia to publish targets for

Scope 3 Finance emission and they have set targets to decarbonize across seven sectors and to cover data up to two sectors this coming back to uh the heart of Borneo in the case of Sabah Sabah is a state in Malaysia um in fact they constitute 72 percent of the unelectrified rural Malaysians right

So one may say that while Malaysia as a whole has very huge asset electricity or energy assess but there’s still quite a number of pockets of the population within server they are facing a lot of challenges mainly because of the difficult terrain right so to meet the

Last miles of the of the remote communities there were efforts where local solar and Micro Hydro resources were deployed this was also thanks to the Grand by the United Kingdom partnering for Accelerated climate transition UK pack in which WWF was also a proud recipient of this grant so this grant enabled

The ngos and experts in in Sabah to kind of map out the the kind of the grids communities and resources availability and therefore form a form of visibility studies so that it will then crowd in potential funds so I think this grant was a good form of Blended Finance not yet Blended

But a good form of a precursor towards blender Finance so yeah and last but not least I know we have three minutes so it is a bit Speedy I’m sure you have seen this movie before it’s an old movie the Need for Speed so I’ll end here by saying that we need a

Speedier but at the same time adjust transition towards a net zero and Equitable economy thank you very much thank you thank you [Applause] thank you very much Dr anime for your very presentation so some key takeaways is that the role of financial institutions such as banks are is really

Important for the transition to create energy and this also needs the support of financial authorities such as the central bank and Financial Services Authority and I think in Indonesia odk bi the central bank as well as the ministers or Finance have been prioritizing on establishing sustainable Finance policy Frameworks such as these

Sustainable Finance Company technical index economy to be able to support the the financial industry thank you very much once again so last but not least I would like to invite Dr John Wong foreign Professor at public policy and management at Monastery University Indonesia he is a consultant to various International organizations such as the undp Asian development bank and the World Bank group and he earned his PhD from the University of Bradford UK Dr John Fong the stage is yours thank you thank you thank you

So I prefer to stand up to talk because it’s easier for you to see me and it’s easier for me to look at your face to make sure you’re not falling asleep okay now I will try to make it very quick well it would take less than 20 minutes

Because I want you to ask questions later on not just one-sided but it has got to be interactive all right so my talk is on the carbon credit trading and Net Zero what are the challenges and how do we reduce this I’m going to focus on

Three things number one the why we shall have carbon markets why carbon trading yeah why and how does this relate to Net Zero number two is the process of people trying to get there then the third one I’m gonna the last slide I would give you the challenges

According to the World Bank not from me dirty bang dunia okay so therefore let’s go straight into it now carbon markets risks and barriers ahead there are three things there’s risk we need to take take care of number one is Project whatever carbon projects you’re doing what is the risk in there number

Two is the risk of regulation in other words yeah and the third one is the risk of the market when you want to do trading when you want to buy and sell of course they’re Market risk yeah so the questions to answer then how can we ensure environmental Integrity of carbon

Credits how do we ensure that these are real carbon credits and not green washing I’m sure you’ve heard of the word green washing so how do we ensure green is green how do we ensure that it is black moving to Brown to moving to Green so we have

To be clear not everything can be green because we have black pearls and then moving to Brown and from brown to Green that’s where Dr Adam was talking about transitional Finance right now how do can we address the barriers to project delivery whatever projects you’re

Thinking of that is net zero how do we ensure that it’s going to be delivered how the third question how can we avoid unintended consequences which is for example green washing how do we avoid brainwashing while allowing people to trade in carbon credits because people

Can do I mean they can carry on business as usual producing carbon but yet they try to buy the carbon credits to offset their own carbon emissions right the fourth question is how will article 6 parents agreement if you just look at article 6.1 6.2 6.3 6.4 those are the

Three important articles in there that talks about collaboration credit okay so that is the collaboration part and the definitions of what is green how do you legally Define and regulate carbon credits because every country is trying to have their own regulation when will we have a single regulations

That everybody can comply with if you have carbon credits the Indonesia your carbon markets in Indonesia different from carbon markets in Singapore different from Hong Kong different from whatever how do we gonna have a single unified platform to do the trading think about that yeah we don’t have the

Answers yet but this is something we need to think about the sixth one question is that what are the tax implications what are the tax implications implications right so those who are from Stan in here should start thinking about that scholar thingy accountancy thinking okay those are from graduate from Stan you better

Start thinking about this right so thank goodness we have already in Indonesia so that the commitment unto NDC which is the target is 2030 that nationally we want to reduce by 29 to 31 percent International then we were reduced by 41 now this is already a national commitment from the government of Indonesia

To help along the way we have badan pangawasan they already have launched their ESG Factor implementation assessment based on 115 indicators now they can go into the bayu MN companies and say that look where are the areas that you have not comply where are the areas area complied with so baby Assessment book and framework framework calculation computation yeah it is assessment all right so please bear in mind a lot of people tell me oh we have so many taxonomies we have so many Frameworks but nobody now in Indonesia have assessment city of organization what are the Clusters that we need to look at

The important clusters to go Net Zero this target for soe assessment is also from baby Cafe and the Clusters is number one Energy number two infrastructure number three yes all these agriculture forestry and agriculture is important infrastructure is important energy transition is important on top of that then you have of course

Mining Industries right so all this needs to be focused on especially on the project delivery we are at the crossroads between do good and our existence so we are not just doing good we are also fighting for our own assist existence maybe a lot of us

In this room says Oh by 2050 pension yeah why do we bother about this no yes to the pension yeah to the pension not only pension but okay so most of us already pension in here why do we border because we border because of what we have are not done

Okay you don’t care what you have Anna in tutu and you have properties you have a lot of land what happened if the the rising of the sea level and will sing your land what will happen to your land bank think about that yeah a lot of people talk about Singapore I

Say Singapore if they’re not careful the island will sink so please when you buy properties in Singapore be careful okay okay all right so getting to Net Zero there are eight actions they’re needed number one increase solar and wind capacity number two cut down reduce electricity generation from coal if possible number three

Maintain the current natural gas so that at least for reliability yeah okay and number four increase zero emission Vehicles that’s what these conference is about how do we have electric vehicles to reduce the carbon increase the sales shares of building heat pumps to 50 heat pumps for

Buildings if you’re in a cold country I suppose if you’re in a hot country like Indonesia you have a cold um not a heat pump all right number six is all new buildings and appliances must mean strict Energy Efficiency targets number seven is r d for carbon capture or sequestration

How to convert carbon straight away into clean air we talk about hydrogen power right so number eight is to build electricity transmission pipelines for carbon dioxide and hydrogen gas now let me share with you somebody talk about palm oil okay oil palm why oil palm people think it is bad for

Carbon emissions why is bad for Net Zero two things can happen number one the waste that comes out from Palm Oil if it is not processed properly it destroys the land and the water where the palm oil is located it destroys the land and water that’s the first thing

Second thing people talk about palm oil a lot of people don’t realize a lot of palm oil Lane owners they try to take back the mangrove swamps the mangrove swamps right yeah what they call it back out I think yeah they try to take the the mangrove swamps for

Planting palm oil but they don’t know the mangrove swamps is the one that can store carbon they don’t know or maybe they don’t know and they don’t care right but the palm oil mangroves worms stores the carbon for a thousand years but they may not know but now you know

Please talk about this yeah to other people so the International Energy agency well comes into this year Just Energy transition partnership jet P there are two organizations when you talk about money and Dr Adam has talked about this there is G fans and Jet p jet p is

Don’t you’re not hearing correctly if you hear Jet Li okay Jet Li is the Kung Fu fighter I’m talking about jet P okay so jet p is Just Energy transition partnership remember the word just the just is not about Hanya just do it like Nike bukan just is about Justice in here

When you want to close down the cold plants you have to think about the community that survives on the coal plant you’ve got to think about the village that gets involved earning their livelihood from the coal plant you could think about it so that you be before you close down anything you have

To think about community ummah okay think about the Community First this is the Just Energy That Just Energy transition partnership now Indonesia has got 20 billion US dollars for Just Energy transition partnership and this is coordinated by the World Bank and the partners Okay so Just Energy transition partnership for Indonesia 20 billion

Vietnam 15 billion South Africa 8 billion there are only three countries in the world they have jet P today now where does G fans come in G fans is Glasgow Financial Alliance for Net Zero defense it is supposed to work like that the 10 billion is from World Bank and the partners

And the next 10 billion is from the members of G fans the members of G fans are the commercial banks of the world like SBC Mitsubishi yeah all those big banks in the world they are part of the G fans so what does that mean that means

You can get the money from these two groups of people in various ways number one Dana bunga Grant how many percent is up to you to negotiate with them then secondly is the conceptional loans that means are you okay and then you come with commercial loans and on top of just the

Lending you also have corporate guarantees especially when you issue green Bond somebody has going to guarantee your bond otherwise your green Bond will become money Triple C but if they were to guarantee your bond it becomes Triple A when you have Triple A you have a better

Margin yeah or born okay so think about all this why sustainable Finance is such an interesting area is because you’ve got to know environment at the same time you know Finance yeah is a multi-disciplinary approach to solve this problem a lot of people go out and study environmental science

Another one go and study something else or Finance but this sustainable Finance combined the two parts and that makes it interesting okay so how carbon credit supports Net Zero so Global carbon Market comprised of compliance voluntary sub-markets businesses can use carbon offsets but provided it doesn’t become green washing number three investors and

Philanthropies people want to give charity can use them to die this diversify their portfolios so this is how carbon credit supports Net Zero and that’s why you have carbon markets because the carbon markets trades in the carbon credits and therefore it supports Net Zero carbon Market it was not

Started just to make money of course you can make money but at the same time it must support it’s not zero okay now I’m not going to go through all the mechanisms because tomorrow you’re going to launch your carbon Market I’m sure you already know what the mechanisms involve I will go straight

Into I will go straight into the challenges number one environmental Integrity to make sure whatever you’re doing don’t do business as usual yeah but in fact have a view towards how to reduce and improve the environment and reduce the carbon ensure social and environmental core benefits that means

You have to make sure it is ESG compliance yeah environmental social and governance ensure sustainable development there are 17 goals in sustainable development right of course you will know the first three or first four or first five of them yeah which is poverty uh hunger and education and good health yeah

Ensuring addressing governance challenges governance to make sure on your board of directors they know enough to Colombo commissaries Indonesia London yeah and most of these commissaries they don’t know anything about ESG they don’t know so if your commissaries don’t know about yes zero so can you please go back to your

Organizations wherever you’re from talk about this all right to your board of commissaries yeah all right addressing Market Integrity ensuring equitable distribution of benefits Justice benefit here and navigating complex policy environments first of all to drive anything has got to be driven from policy if there’s no policy Frameworks

It’s very difficult to change anything let’s face it if you change anything without policy is called Revolution right it’s called rioting yeah once you have policy then you are complying to the laws of the country so everybody I want to thank you for your time [Applause]

Thank you very much uh Dr John Wong for your very informative presentation so in the beginning he touched about the importance of green uh assessment not only just a framework but a more concrete assessment that can be implemented to reduce carbon emission and also uh towards the end of the

Presentation you also touch about the role of a carbon trading Market you said that it is useful for business to reduce emissions but it’s also useful for investors to uh to Define their diversify their portfolio and earn some some some profit from this sort of uh great investment so

Once again please give a round of applause to all of our three speakers and now I would like to move our discussion to uh the Q a session so I invite the audience to ask questions you can uh break your hand or come to the nearest Mig and say your name

Institution and then you you can say which which speaker you want to address your question so I yes please someone will come yes please okay thank you my name is Indonesia I have three questions first I would like to know your view about uh carbon credit because currently

We have uh three Fields about carbon credit the first one is of course the one who support the carbon credit the second one the opposite they disagree about carbon credit because this group believed that it can harm our uh strategy to Net Zero but then the uh the

Third one they believe that in the middle there we can sell or buy carbon credit but for the same sector because if if we produce emission for energy sectors for example but then we buy the carbon credit for uh Forestry is very cheap compared to investing in

Renewable energy so it can harm our Target as well so I would like to know your view but this uh issue the second one because most countries are Lag behind their NDC targets so some people argue that cross-border carbon credit should be banned unless your country already

Achieved your the target so what do you think about this uh issue and this the third one and the last one about voluntary carbon standard do you think it should be created by the industry or by Regulators that’s all thank you thank you very much uh fire from bang

Indonesia so let me summarize the the question the first ones related to uh the uh the credit of the carbon trading market and the second one uh is about the cross-border carbon credit uh whether it should be bad or not if a country hasn’t met its Target and the third one regarding the

Uh voluntary carbon Market standardization so I think uh Dr Adam can help answer the question and probably later Dr John can help too thank you yeah so um this is a caveat I didn’t cover carbon Credit in my presentation but I’m happy to to address that given

My interest as well on the first question um the existing call the medication hierarchy whereby you focus on the key actions first before you offset so for example in the case of energy sector there’s key to basic the first step should be energy saving and then you look into Energy Efficiency

Then Renewables then low emission then only then you’re offset right when it goes into let’s say Waste Management the first step it should be you prevent waste from happening then the second step if you have to have ways then you minimize the ways and then if you have a

Lot of ways then you reuse recycle and and then towards the end only we then only recover the energy and and go through the carbon credit um so in a nutshell carbon credit or offset uh is a key kind of action but it should be done when as a so-called Last

Resort when other decarbonization strategies and actions have been taken on the second Point um maybe maybe that that I won’t go into much more detail because it will involve National accounting uh complexity but what this key here is to avoid double counting so you don’t double count your

Your credit registry or credit inventory right at the national level on the third point I think it is key to recognize the role of regulator so in the case of Malaysia for example the stock exchange the booster Malaysia have set up um the the so-called market exchange so

As a so-called regulator Market shaper they have set up that that exchange they have also set up certain standards and that that’s precisely the role of regulator you set up standards to ensure that the carbons are of certain credit quality and also Integrity right then

The market comes in I think in the case of Singapore it’s also quite interesting they have uh they have set up this common impact exchange whereby it’s a mix of of both market and Regulatory kind of efforts and then of course the industry will play their role when it

Comes to price and Market Discovery right so you would know and I’m gonna give you the examples and you can think about this when we first talk about don’t talk about carbon credit let’s talk about bezel when bezel first come out everybody say if you’re going to top up

The capital on bezel where have we got the chance to use the capital to lend the money because the more money you lend the more risk Capital you’re going to put in which is uh your tier one and tier 2 Capital it’s the same question

Now we have carbon where we say hey can we do something to ensure that your carbon is reduced and everybody says what is our profitability this was the same question that Banks addressed when we talk about bezel this is long time ago now the bezel thing is is settled

Whether you like it or not you have to do it on the third question is that shall we do a voluntary or regulated markets and I’ll come back to you shall we do cryptocurrency that is like Bitcoin or we do Central Bank cryptocurrency same system same thinking why because

You you do crypto without regulation the the risk is much greater the volatility is greater but if you have a regulated market there’s more orderly and then you know who is doing the trades so um uh Revolution okay thank you thank you very much Dr random and Dr

John for the answers I hope that uh answer your question and I think uh for the next round I think we have a question from hello thank you moderators for the chance to raise questions uh I have two questions actually one is related to pahiru that you mentioned before uh

Regarding the trade and then three of the speakers three of the speakers already mentioned about regulations uh from from your side I appreciate if you can wear us which body International body that you think able to manage the international standard like generally mentioned vessel for example for banking industry

Because this is about trade carbon trade and nothing zero later on special uh questions for Linux uh for John funk you only share with us the eighth step to facing the Net Zero into 050 from all the information that they share with us look like you only focus not you

I think it’s just what banks Focus only to prevent they forget how to read repair the distractions that made by the mining industry I think by repair them to to do the forest for a stationary later on they will create a cardboard why they forgot to pay attention on this

Thank you very much the question so I think uh doctor can help us answer the question again so the first one is about which body should uh regulate the uh the uh the screen for for the banking sector and sorry can you please repeat the second question again

This is second questions related to eight steps that already shared by John Fong’s if you see the eight things the eight at the eight ones it’s only focused on the prevention to reduce the carbon Productions but it’s not focused to how to create the O2 by repair the distractions that made by the

Mining industry thank you thank you I think how to read what about how the O2 okay let me do the last one first okay which is easier the uh how reducing carbon is one increasing the oxygen is by technology so a lot of people now is talking about sequestration a lot of

People are talking about renewable energy this is how you get clean energy so a lot of technology companies are involved in that maybe you’ll find Elon Musk very soon we have a idea of his own so watch out for Elon Musk okay he will come up with some brand new ideas I’m

Sure yep so uh is all based on technology all right so to that’s the first question what about the the sorry that was the last question what about the first question which International body should manage the green or the great sustainable findings for the banking sector okay of course

For the banking sector everybody knows already is between ojeka and Bae so you have to manage that but however other Ministries ought to be a stakeholder in this Net Zero achievement and the answer to that is that for example the ministry of environment has got to be involved the

Ministry of Fisheries has got to be involved the end the ministry of energy and the ministry of Minds all those are involved because to move towards this all together there are seven or eight clusters that are very important in Indonesia seven or eight clusters of Industry that are very important

Indonesia so and all these clusters of in uh all these clusters are governed under certain Ministries so all those Ministries must be involved as a stakeholder or although the main coordinator can be ojeka and be thank you maybe Dr Adam can add a bit what about International bodies

In like international organization is it should it be under bazel or something else yeah um hello hello I’m not very familiar with the international standard for carbon trading uh so so I will uh move on to the in the the remark that Dr John was mentioning I think the the

Collaboration is very important uh between National level entity Ministry of Finance Ministry of environment as well as the central bank financial Regulators I think that that that kind of uh Synergy is is very important because uh traditionally environmental mandates or issues were not within the central banks and financial supervisory

Mandate but since the launch of the network for Greening for the financial system the then GFS we have seen an increasing number of central banks and financial Regulators that recognize environmental and also to some extent social risks and opportunities as part of them in their policy mending so I

Think that that is a very interesting transformation and I think banks in the context of Indonesia as well are also mandated or required by OJ Carr to kind of look into climber stress test in our analysis risk management and so on thank you so I think Dr Stanley Council

Wants to comment on this too yes I I would like to share some The View on this uh as somebody actually have been on the front line of meeting with both the buyer and the sellers and the project owners I do have a very good feeling about what’s actually happened

Out there and what’s the gaps I think what we really need on the in for a region of Asia the role of the government’s respect to the warranty carbon Crafters actually need to be refought we always know that there’s a mandatory common trading system which is a mentally regulated we all understand

That the vcm market at the moment is actually very loose even globally the different standards the the they’re actually more than 10 or even 15 standard bodies doing their own work people try to make sure that all these can be aligned under one current standard so The credibility of those

Being traded uh actually being not regulated but actually facilitated and be transparent is still happening today so that you have the Integrity Council I think for Asia it’s actually very important for the financial sector particularly The Regulators to look we look at the whole issue about warrant

Traveling credits not try to regulate it but to facilitate facility is very different from regulation facility means the flow of information the availability of database the transparency or transaction the price bench making all these are facilitation those are not regulation I think Indonesia have a very

Strong role to play as one of the largest sort of entity of countries in Asia that will be a major supplier I think it’s actually very important for transparency to be initiated by the initial market and also in terms of the alive other countries in Asia like

Singapore who Bob is going to be one of the largest buyers and also potentially spreading it into asean and not forgetting about China which is going to be the second largest economy in the world with their own system of buying and sellers so I think it’s important to

Ask you to facilitate it by the government not regularly please don’t regulate the vcm second point I want our emphasizes we don’t have satorial plan what do you mean by saturation we talk about National pathway we’ll go from here to 2015 to achieve nestro by 1250. we need is industry-based sectorial

Pathway so you will get mining industries of you know get the forestry industry every energy should have their own pathway going twice there there are already work being done not enough Indonesia we think about if we are focusing on several industry sectors in Indonesia which is going to be a very

Major sector for the trading system we should develop the satorial pathway on how this industry setup will move them today to Net Zero and then helping them at what stage they go into government offset what are the facilitation what what are the bottleneck to help them sectorial pathway are very important but

We lack it even globally thank you insightful answers so I think it requires cross-institution cooperation and as well this different aspects of sustainable Finance needs different framework like the PCM it needs not regulation but facilitation so I think hopefully that that answers your question uh so the next question is please oh

Excuse me I would like to ask to Dr Stanley yip or concerning your representation your highlight the contribution of fera that currently uh have having shared more than 72 percent and I think as we know Malaysia and also Singapore adopting Federal and Global standards for Singapore for their carbon market and I

Think it’s related to the high acceptability for the global market related to this standard and in your recommendation you’re highlighting the importance of developing the regional standard that also consider the socio-economic and the of these uh Regional and I would like to ask and your opinion regarding how to develop

The regular standard that also has high credibility and also High acceptance for the global market especially for the technical base is thank you very much I think okay questions related okay so so he stood for the original market right yes yeah I think it’s a very very good question as I mentioned

We need to facilitate the voluntary market and at the moment the bottleneck and the problem of the of the vcm uh particularly in Asia fall down to three problem number one we don’t have enough database which are available for the student when we are quantifying a lot of

The impact based on any methodology different people are using their own interpretation or database so that they join different databases or some of them surveys some other from there their sources and then for some reason it’s very difficult for the standard body on their own to verify all this database

Validity and it all comes down to the third party verification agency to do it but let’s face it the first party agency only also Limited in terms of resources and knowledge you wouldn’t expect everybody to understand all the Sciences of different sectors of this Market it’s very difficult so governments should

Start to look at a very original coordination or database for different sectorial usage like forestry like mining like buildings and then start to be sure that those database are basically available for anybody to use and with strong level credibility what we are trying to do actually in China is

Working with the ministry of housing to standardize the building database for coming credits so that we only have one set of database or one group of database which I actually verified by the government the government the ministry is not going to intervene into the market but they basically say this is

Database we use this is the map benchmarking the Baseline this is it use it and then build your Baseline that I think the government have a lot to say that that goal comes down to death to Authority and the resources government has in terms of putting the data

Together and make sure that data can be made used by the market that actually is the number one problem and number one challenges and this will be resolved and can be resolved the number two is actually based on in terms of the professionalism of this industry honest

See as somebody actually on the front line I think we are far from a very professional and very high level of sophistication for the industry the whole ecosystem I actually mixed with a lot of very good professional unintendent bodies but also reasonable number of people actually are actually

Not really up to their standard or understanding what’s the protocol what that markets look like so we need some kind of industry Association or some kind of Standards or professional qualification to make sure that people actually handling they want to recovery Market have certain level of basic information and basic knowledge about it

Before they can handle it we need that because the market is going very fast a lot of people are entering into this Market but not all many of them actually have that official or formal or well detailed training to be able to do it we need that otherwise we’re driving away

The budget owners so I think that’s very important one last thing I want to mention we respond to some of the questions earlier is it’s very important for the voluntary current market and as a tool to offer financial support and investment to offset project

I met with a lot of owner I worked with an a animal waste sort of uh farms in China and also one actually probably in in Malaysia they just simply put away all the animal waste in the farm and let the methane emit into the air until one day they

Realized that by separating the waste and the treaty they can generate Financial return and I did some calculation it’s very attractive for them to actually do a bit more one step forward simply to reduce the emotional human methane a lot of our owners people on the front line out there didn’t

Realize the potential friends of return they can do by taking one more step on mitigating emission and that I think the financial status should have positive messages to them and say here we are we are interested invest in this take one more step and we say to her thank you foreign

First one it requires a strong government capacity to develop a regular standard and it also needs the support of Industry professionalism and the third one so carbon offset projects also need strong financing from the financial institutions so thank you so I think next question is should I stand or just sit

Okay thank you uh thank you moderator uh thank you as well Dr Stanley Dr Adam and Dr John for your presentations uh recall myself is actually one of the uh persons to some extent maybe uh have to responsible for what happened now with the initiative on the system of

Finance in Indonesia because back 2018 2017 when we have the first regulations on the system of Finance as well as when we issue the social refinance map issue in 2020 something I was part of the process at the time and for sure then a lot of questions and

A lot of discussions already being conducted as well but but the issue is no I do realize that observing your presentations I can see that we are talking on a very high level of policies right but to me the issue is actually how we put this on the very Grassroots level

You know how we are uttering the mindset the culture of our people otherwise then the issue on this uh Dr Stanley mentions about the challenges Dr John means it’s about the eight action that we have to take 2030 with it will be to me sorry my perspective will

Be saying that it will be useless unless that people really understand the benefit of having this carbon reductions initiatives in place otherwise people say I’m not sure whether I want to do it because it’s not really benefit myself so I think so in a lot of session I always share about

This you know the garbage bins in the train stations I don’t know whether in Singapore in Malaysia it’s it will be in standard already that you have three types of garbage beans but Indonesia when you come to stations every station has their own standard on the garbage beans sometimes three sometimes two and

People we have can put this waste into the which one where there is a recycle or this is a reuse or is something like that so people are still confusing whether it’s it’s relevant to ourselves the issue on on social Finance or carbon reductions whenever when we Face the issue in a

Very practical you know situation it’s far away from our understandings about these system of violence so I don’t know whether the initiative actually that the government from the beginning said to these uh you know the kindergarten or pre-elementary and Elementary School they have to set the policies to change the mindset with

People that in 2030 that everybody not already which ways that belong to which garbage bins actually right otherwise then is sorry to say that we still away from you know the issue on how we are reducing the uh emissions uh so I just want to know how you see

About that idea is uh that’s it’s it’s not only we put on the on the level of the government only but then the government will have to be you know being said as well the the educational uh uh what is it uh curriculum you know for people from the earlier beginning of the

School age otherwise that no we cannot really move very fast Dr Adam mentioned accelerated I don’t think you can accelerate if people from you know from the very young until this uh like us five years from now or 24 people now then there’s a lot of changes already in

In the air in the area of the system of Finance so that’s one of the questions from the very practical uh experience that I have right now and the second one is as a Regulators as a Regulators when we have the social Finance I want to put it as similar to this but

Dr Joe man says about the Basel framework so there is no International standard really that set how we are you know allocating Banks and also non-bank financial institutions allocating more capital for this uh for this accessible finance and also for the climate change in particular we’re talking about transition race we’re talking about

Physical race how you put these two type operates into the vessel Capital allocations framework into the banks I haven’t yet seen any kind of that approach in in the vessel framework so the vessel framework is actually for bank that really kind of like already well established but it

Cannot be really really imitated into the other non-bank funding institutions so I think if the banks goes first then I think the non-bank financials can go afterwards so that’s that’s why I think uh to my understandings I have like the internet standards come must also have the you

Know the initiatives where you put this physical resistances generation to this basal Capital allocation framework I learned that we can put it under pillar too I don’t know whether participants really understandable by John but I think she can put it under pillar too because on the pillow one is already

Talking about Marketplace and operates but under pillar 2 there’s like Discretions of the supervisor to ask for more capital and on Capital on top this uh what is it given already uh race and the pillow one so uh that’s two uh I don’t know whether it’s questionable just a issue of our

Discussions today as part of discussion today thank you so much and back to the moderator thank you thank you very very interesting questions I guess I think the first one can be answered by all speakers so it is related to how to make this High context policies sustainable Finance policies

To be understandable by Grassroots or by just Layman people like this place I’m from Monash University and whatever Baba I said these are the two major areas of research right now one is called behavioral change to climate behavioral change climate action yeah for example from now onwards we don’t eat bakso anymore we

Just eat meccan bakso because bakso comes from sapi and usapi produce a lot of methane gas okay okay so how do we convince people to do that there’s number one number two is the queen of cooking a lot of chefs tell me you cook by gas and cook by

Electricity there’s a difference because you cook by electricity it delays the heat when you want to turn it down it delays the heat when you turn it up it also delays it whereas gas is easier the chefs tell me that so it takes a long time to convince the chefs as well

So this is all about behavioral change but and it will take your correct when they didn’t to talk about how to do secular economy to reduce reuse yeah to reduce whatever and to reuse whatever we cannot reduce right so these are the changes now in

Terms of uh the bezel 2 or bezel 3 the pillar one and the pillar two and the pillar three are all affected I’ll start with pillar three pillar three now you have sustainability reporting that comes from IFRS and ISB now it is voluntary but soon to be mandatory so pillar 3 is

Taken care of your pillow one in your credit analysis of course we have to do that because when we are doing credit letters there will be a part of environmental risk that’s in the credit analysis and pillar two of course you have the supervisory approach to it as well that’s why I say

The commissaries is very important for me I want to com convince the commissaries first but if the commissaries don’t know they won’t know what to discuss they don’t know what to approve so we have to talk to the commissarism yeah so because I’m also commissaries in another bank so I know

That my other commissaries they don’t understand Net Zero what is this so I have to tell them and minimum copy and makan Lumpur a lot of times to tell them slowly all right thank you thank you yeah thanks very much I think I think that’s that the question is such a very

Valid one and I could not help but try to tell what I think about it I remember 15 years ago when I started going into the research work on Camp accounting measuring or carbon nobody brought about it nobody know what carbon was very difficult even to get some funding so it

Took us probably 15 years 20 years until today that everybody now are very aware of the importance of carbon and start to learn about it but let’s face it we don’t have another 15 or 20 years ahead of us the time is ticking if he’s saying there or less stuff with structural basic

Fundamental education and teach our kids the importance of carbon dioxide emission of course that is important that have to be mandatory done ever to understand it but I think the more important thing is we only have 20 some years ahead of us to 2050. within that period of time what is

Possible what is impossible need to make a decision about it so I think the financial center is important why foreign Center the government or the industry can always release messages to the market and tell the market what is important what the money can we make and how you can actually get benefit by

Messages by a very good system and that can change the world very quickly whatever that is execution of debt messages into the market is the more effective way of making changes in Behavior let me tell you a practical situation we’re working in with a bundle of farmers in Vietnam on coffee

Cultivation try to encourage them to switch from chemical fertilizer to organic fertilizer which we can reduce nitrogen as emission let’s face it the only thing they care about is will they be actually earning more money I’m not saying that we should not educate them we need to educate them but

We only have 20 something years to go so the financial Market should actually add to give a rather positive sorry messages that if you reduce harm that’s a mission to action you get benefited by the market and that means market pricing give a value to carbon get very transparent very sophisticated system of

Transaction is all important that can change the world within short period of time thank you You wear a smart watch right and uh I don’t know whether it triggers us now that we should get moving yeah so my watch uh start trigger is basically this is called if you look into behavioral economics nudging the nudge Theory right uh this little smart

Watch here has just nudged me to get moving because I’ve been sitting too long right um so behavioral change could could be nudged through as very systemic fundamental bottom up like education but it could be as simple as from the gadgets like that so now we a lot of us

Wearing smart watches we track our calories number of steps and so on and this this will not have happened if there’s no Smartwatch technology the same with carbon climate as well it needs to start with of course fundamentals Foundation but there’s lots of not just technological not just uh

Movie nudges from Tom Cruise for example they could not just so coming to a more serious note on on the bis aspect of things yes we have not seen any concrete translation into Capital requirements liquidity and so on but the bis has also issued a number of principles FAQ

Leaning towards that direction and so before Capital requirements could be set there are a number of measures such as scenario analysis stress tests and number of other measures that being enforced in many countries so our proposition from WF is to see how those stress test results could be then

Translated into real action so one of the actions could be Capital requirements and so on but again if you look at from a more holistic standpoint there are a number of building blocks in which regulation could take take place right so it’s not just Capital requirements and liquidity ratios but

There are there could be other aspects like disclosure requirements exposure limits and so on we have seen also the likes of Hungary Hungary has set up um a kind of incentive a capital incentive for Green Loans but for specific projects so it’s not so much penalizing but more incentivizing but I

Think going forward we will see the other flip side of the penalizing aspect of capital requirements and so on thank you thank you very much for the answer so to summarize a bit so I think lies uh Dr Stanley noted that it requires the financial institution to play part and

Market mechanism as well to play part so when the market already incorporates this kind of thing into the mechanism I think it’s a lot easier for General people to understand and try to implement uh this sustainable Finance business nothing related to your second question as Dr Adam said as well I think

Basil is going to that direction and maybe because bezel is also cooperating with ngfs right now and I think we might want to see that kind of framework in the near future so once again thank you very much for the uh questions I would like to invite several uh questions from our online

Participant so the first one is from Daniel unrest from Zoom so the question is for a developed country like Indonesia renewable energies and expensive investment even even some rich European countries consider it expensive because of the high maintenance costs so how do we start and what kind of

Technology do we need to invest first considering our country’s budget capability yeah sure well thank you Daniel for asking the question I’m going to give you a simple solution this has been tried and before okay is nothing new but I’m just sharing with you um you can involve in any technology you want

No matter however expensive it is provided somebody is willing to finance you okay long time ago there was a financing scheme that came out from the World Bank and it goes like this let’s say it is wind power wind power will take a long time to experiment where you need to locate that

Machine that generates the wind power you need three years of research to do wind power so World Bank came up with this idea that whoever wants to do it they can borrow the money from the World Bank at concessional loan successful this loan will becomes an equity

If it is successful the loan will become Equity convertible loan all right or a convertible Bond but if it is unsuccessful loss sharing which is very Islamic banking is Bank Sharia you know lost sharing is Bank Sharia in the true sense so if it is unsuccessful law sharing but

If successful the loan becomes Equity or a bond thank you yeah so um so it’s a very valid question I think there are both policy solution and uh non-policy solution for policy solution I think this is tackling the the kind of uh the big elephant in the

Room which is basically creating a Level Playing Field between fossil and renewable energy in the case of India we have seen what India has done between fossil fuel subsidy swap so you kind of text fossil fuel which is or mining industry which is can be also very

Political and uh tricky but at the same time you you swap it with subsidy for renewable and green efforts so that is one one policy decision that needs to be made in terms of non-policy options we have seen in the case of New South Wales in Australia whereby they develop a

Strategy to have a large integrated renewable energy Zone in the case of Malaysia I think we’re also looking into re Zone large industrial zones and this would basically facilitate financing and in the case of New South Wales it attracted over Aussie dollar 43 billion investment at the ground level when you talk about

Residential solar projects we have seen also efforts in the case of New Zealand whereby the country or in certain Pockets where they aggregate small residential solar projects into one subscription lease model so that will create the critical mass reduce the probability of default or credit risk and and therefore uh make it more

Economic economic and economics of scale uh we have also seen the case of uh platforms uh with the new tech we call uh solar as a service SAS whereby you have solar leasing with fix-free without any upfront costs in the US we have seen since some of the initiative startups

Have started this to kind of offload that initial uh are from upfront costs yeah thank you so I think it’s related to the availability of financing also a government policy and then scale because if you can achieve economies of scale you can improve efficiency and it makes

Things cheaper and also the role of technology and Innovation as well and one final question from YouTube from kellyanne so the question is in your view which country in Asia should oversee the carbon trade or Net Zero movement should a single platform be used to standardize the trading of carbon credits and how

So I think this is addressed to I I think this is also a very good questions uh because I always allude to the fact that transparency is very important in terms of trading in the vcm market uh there’s always a sort of a worry about it in terms of double

Counting double counting is so important on the issue but today honestly there isn’t a very effective way of trying to checking where this project are actually being used more than once and both in terms of the transaction and also in terms of the the deposit itself internal registration because we have so many

Different tender bodies happening at the same time but works are already started to try to make sure that some kind of information so alignment between that but I think we need I think I think it’s actually well Bank actually have an initiative to try to make sure that the

Major standard body in the body can be all come aligned together and then we have access to their registry at the same time so anybody can actually check a particular project with a specific identity then where they already resistor in more than one registry and but that can only be done with actually

Some kind of authority and legal backing because you’re actually trying to put them all together and I think RCN as a whole should actually start to explore this and and if you ask you which countries particularly of course I’ll prefer Indonesia you know one of the largest supplier in the world in this

Region if you start to think about whether you can be actually taking the leadership of style to orchestrate together a framework so that the registry or the project within Asia at least can actually be seen through one single platform that actually is not that difficult but why that you have

Consent from the center body it’s only a matter of put them into one type of contact accessible by everybody that transparency of a project where it is which she register what is it all doing will go big way to help the market to be mature so Indonesia go ahead don’t do it

Thank you very much any further comments no so I think yeah I just want to add on that I think I do agree that the thing cross-border collaboration is important we have seen this happening this this month where Thailand Malaysia Indonesia Has Come Together the stock exchanges

Have come together and signed in mou to look into ESG kind of platform and so on they have not come into carbon yet because it’s still new but ESG kind of cross-border exchange of information listing requirements and so on are already overcame progress thank you

Thank you very much so I think this is a very good opportunity for Indonesia to lead the movement of uh sustainable finance and green finders in Southeast Asia and I think like Dr Stanley mentioned issues such as transparency the avoidance of double counting as well as the establishment of standardizing

Standardization bodies are crucial to achieve regular standards so again thank you very much let’s give another round of applause to all of the speakers [Applause] this has been a very productive morning and I hope we learned a lot today from the presentations from the Q a sessions

And I think the time is almost up now before the end of the the first finalization I would like to uh invite my invention to the stage to give souvenirs to uh the speakers foreign Deputy Commissioner of the board of commissioner and Logistics of the ojk handing over souvenirs to the speakers and moderators please Thank you A group photo please Okay three two one please give big around a plows for the first station panel discussion Okay thank you This is Okay thank you all for your active participation in the morning sessions it’s not time for a well-deserved lunch break please enjoy your buffet lunch at the aisle in front of the ballroom and take this opportunity to network with fellow participants we will reconfin here at quarter past one or 1 15 pm

The afternoon stations bon appetit thank you [Applause] Foreign All right [Applause] [Applause] Foreign thank you Foreign okay to me thank you I don’t know Thank you David Foreign thank you Foreign Foreign Foreign foreign Foreign foreign foreign foreign Foreign come on I’m sorry thank you Foreign okay thank you Foreign Foreign Excited Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Thank you Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign foreign thank you Foreign Foreign foreign Thank you Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Foreign Thank you Foreign Thank you Foreign Foreign Foreign Thank you Foreign As a requirement to get e-certificate please make sure that all participants online and offline feel and submit the feedback form that available on the front screen and check box thank you Thank you thank you Foreign Foreign Foreign ladies and gentlemen we are gonna start the second session with executive speech from Mr imansha Mr imansha the floor is yours [Applause] thank you thank you moderators uh and a very good afternoon for all of us Excellency chairman of Board of Commissioners for Financial Services Authority or ojk uh director of Australia Indonesia partnership for economic development of prospera distinguished speakers and moderators officials from my fellows Ministries and institutions my fellows ojk

From a head office as well as from regionals and all participants that join us in our seminar today ladies and gentlemen I will try to deliver some kind of like insights and views on behalf of the Board of Commissioners this afternoon we got to our meetings this up today and this afternoon

With the team of the Save the Planet the role of financial sector to support carbon reductions and electrical and electric vehicles development ladies and gentlemen I think so when we follow the presentations within the morning sessions we all know that the issue of climate change is already take place

As we experienced today as well how we are facing our days now with what extreme climate uh it’s so hot and people suffering uh lack of waters in every lot of areas of Indonesia and I think it is very much valid because based on the data of National Aeronautics and Space

Administration in the last 10 years the Earth’s temperature has increased by 0.86 degrees celsius compared to average temperature in 1951 to 1980. so it’s quite strange that I am using wearing suit this afternoon ladies and gentlemen because I think it’s more comfortable with buttocks instead of having suit with a equipment right is

It’s harder to have suits rather than having Orthopedic with us but anyway that’s it really the situations we are facing today because the global warming has caused environmental problems such as rising sea levels I think Dr John mentioned this morning so be careful if you are investing into

A very close to uh Seashore because the icing sea levels will affecting your investment in the future uh forest fires changed in the rain patterns floods extreme weather and destructive storms I think so we can follow the issue the situations based what we see from the TV news and and also other media

The impact of climate change in Indonesia economy and finance sector among other insurance sector losses due to climate-induced disaster rates 0.1 percent of GDP in 2018 so I think it’s quite huge the number of losses because of this climate disasters and the number of strategies caused by climate change increased from 200

49 in 1980 to 820 in 2000. 19 so in two years in 20 years time almost the number of tragedies caused by climate change is double so it’s it’s something that worry us a lot and experts have estimated that an increase in global temperature by 3.2 degrees of Celsius could potentially

You raise up to 18.1 of the global GDP by 2015. so I don’t want to bring a lot of this data statistics into ourselves today because all of this data is is quite frightening for us as well right because everything is goes into more severe conditions compared to uh decades before

So what is what we can learn from the morning session is actually how we are moving forward to set the standard facing the challenges and come up with the resolution and the solutions or our property of the challenges and also something that we can see what we have

To do eight actions in 2013 that assist us to save our planet that’s really the issue the very basic issue what we are having from our International Research Forum today like this and then and gentlemen as the global awareness regarding climate change increase in the past few years International agreements to tackle

Climate change have been ratified by the majority of countries that are members of the United Nations or un so we can have the inside the knowledge coming from what is really initiative introduce by the Kyoto agreement in 2019-97 by the Paris agreement in 2015-15 and also conference from the parties cop

27 in 2022 that in common they’ll come up with like a initiatives including as well fund for Country suffering losses from the impact of climate change increasing awareness and Targets on climate change and threatening emission targets to align with the parish agreement by 2030. so as for the continuation of the Paris

Agreement the target is lowered and the policy level of each country including Indonesia in the form of national determined contributions or NDC each Country Must report post 2020 climate change mitigation actions in nationally determined contributions document to be provided to the unit to the United Nations framework conventions on climate change of UNF

Triple C the NDC document set a target of reducing greenhouse gas emissions in Indonesia and between 29 percent with with Indonesian on efforts and 41 conditionally with adequate international sport by 2030. however the enhanced NDC the emission reduction Target by set effort increase to 30 almost 32 percent by 2030 and with the

Internationalization to 42.2 percent and Net Zero emission Target no later than 2016 or sooner as stated in the enhanced nationally determined contribution document that was submitted in the United Nation on September 20th 3 2022. so just wondering where where we are in 2016 uh ladies and gentlemen hopefully

We can still Witnesses what happened with the our planet and we are going we are moving forward for the better environment in 2016. ladies and gentlemen uh in order to reach the aforementioned emissions Target and combat climate change Indonesia has formulated several National strategic policies that are cross-sectoral and cross industry from

The environmental aspect there is the forestry and other land use netsing 2030 policy to mitigate carbon emissions through Powers 3 and green Open Spaces from the part of consumer Behavior the development of public transportation modes and the development of electric vehicle industry from the economic aspects carbon pricing policy as well as

Carbon taxes and facilitating the threading of carbon credits through carbon Exchange these also include financial sector right so the financial scale also contributes in mitigating climate change through social Finance policies to channel financing for long-term environmentally oriented projects I think this becoming more uh affirmative for us and being standing as

Well by the issue of financial sector development setting law of paid us in 2023 that very specifically inside that law mentions about the sustainable Finance and in addition to that articles there’s something that has been said as well that to establish accessible finance committee or Community consisting of the major Finance Bank

Indonesia and also the Financial Service Authority or ogk it Mendes the preparations of accessible taxonomy by this uh communication as a guideline for the financial industry or JK and relevant Ministries updated the Indonesian green taxonomy as a classification standard and guide for the implementation of sessional finance and to support transition activities for

The action for the ancient taxonomy for sustainable Finance and the histories recalls us as well you know that the we should already already the relevant pojk since 2017. on the title with this uh green uh sustainable Finance as well as the green bones and green soup Cooks of course all that efforts

Is like initial efforts from the ojk we have also issued the SE second roadmap on the Central Finance and we are very much looking into more detailed actions that we can uh come up later on with how we are implement the roadmap in a more effective way

So the issue ladies and gentlemen is not actually about the regulations so the issue is how we are Walk The Talk concept is there already but how to implement and how to become more effective for us not only in particular for the banking sector but I think it’s also

We have to initiate as well how we are implementing the issue of sustainable Finance for the non-bank financial institution as well as the other relevant Industries so through this event we hope that there will be an increased coordination and research as well related to server Finance topic which significantly

Supports the task of ojk and also related ministers in the process of formulating future policies to facilitate the transformation of sustainable Finance Indonesia to achieve the target of reducing admission to net zero emissions by 2016. so hopefully my remarks will uh like an introductions for our second

Discussion this afternoon so it must as on the title we have this discussion already on the carbon reductions and the speaker this afternoon we’ll talk more on the electric vehicle developments ah hopefully we can have also a very good and also relevant and very deep inside coming from the speakers in this

Afternoon and hopefully we can share our insight as well during the question and answer sessions so that’s what I can share and deliver as introductions for the second session this afternoon ladies and Gentlemen please enjoy and contribute again your inside views and knowledge in this second session of this today

Research Forum thank you so much and I stopped here and was thank you [Applause] thank you Mr Iman Shah ladies and gentleman at this juncture I would like to delegate decision to our moderator Mrs Amelia who will facilitate a presentation and panel discussion with all distinguished speakers Mrs Amelia

Please take it from here [Applause] thank you thank you very much vera for the kind introduction and uh distinguished gas ladies and gentlemen Welcome to our second panel discussion today we’re going to be talking about an array of topics surrounding the future and the impact on our future with regards to electric vehicles but first allow me to

First introduce myself so my name is Amelia Yahya and I’m based in Singapore and I was a news anchor for CNN Indonesian correspondent for CNN International and I’m so incredibly honored so very happy to be here to be a part of this incredible day as your moderator especially with everyone here

And our first and foremost on behalf of ojeka allow us to extend our proof on gratitude and sincere thanks to everyone for your participation and for your attendance here today ladies and gentlemen to living up our Spirits really without your support this event would not be possible so for that let us

Give the biggest run of Applause for everyone here [Applause] thank you check thank you very much I’d like to also thank our organizers that’s been working tirelessly in making sure that our events goes as smoothly as possible Now ladies and gentlemen when we talk about this topic presented at

Hand with us today and that is on saving the planet on the role of financial sector to support carbon reduction and particularly on the second panel discussion on electric vehicles developments we of course must also touch base on the future of our planet the quality of our life as well as our

Cities and really on every single aspect that we are talking about today ladies and gentlemen it is all tied to the evolution of Transportation yes when we talk about electric vehicles ladies and gentlemen we are not just talking about a trend as it is also on adaptation on

Our future ladies and gentlemen it also mentions as well as highlights on the importance of our technological innovations as well as our transformative shift and force that is shaping the world today and ladies and gentlemen as we know all of our ojekas events it serves as one of the most

Notable events for all of us here to acquire as well as understand the most updated and the most accurate information especially with regards to um what is driving the financial sector and on this special panel discussion on electric vehicles so ladies and gentlemen I’m going to invite and

Feature to you a great great list of uh panelists with us today and they are undoubtedly the experts in their respective fields and together we’re going to learn so much from them but before I invite them onto the stage ladies and gentlemen I understand that many of you have been here since morning

Time so we’re going to learn so much but we’re also going to have a little bit of fun therefore I’d like you to take out your phones ladies and gentlemen as let us start this session with a game of kahoots so ladies and gentlemen we’re going to

Present to you a um QR code for all of you to uh join us in this game of kahoot and we ask you to please answer the questions and uh as yes as you can see here oh sorry on mentee go to mensi.com and please answer the code of 420-30059

And on what you know about electric vehicles ladies and gentlemen I would like you to participate and tell us about your insights as well as your answers on this first question on what do you know about electric vehicles we’ve already gotten many oh 10 responses and it’s growing thank you

Very much ladies and gentlemen for participating and yes as you can see all the keywords that we see on the screen zero emission clean and green environmentally friendly Innovation so much to talk about on this very session and uh 52 responses and still growing thank you so much everyone for your

Participation and for your attendance here today on saving the planet ladies and gentlemen particularly on the developments of electric vehicles yes ladies and gentlemen over a hundred now how incredible and so look when we talk about electric vehicle look at that green washing as well as uh on unlocking infra transformation

Environmentally friendly Green energy and Tesla of course one of the most forward Brands when we talk about electric vehicles and uh battery when it comes to battery we we’re also going to touch base on that specific subject as it is the subject that many of us are still doing the little dance and

Questioning on how um yes the longevity of the battery itself that we’re going to be talking about on electric vehicles all right so ladies and gentlemen we’ve got 156 responses thank you so much let’s give everyone here a big round of applause [Applause] all right so ladies and gentlemen there

We have it thank you very very much for your participation on the uh game and uh thank you so much for giving us your insights was your answer on what you know about electric vehicles so without further Ado ladies and gentlemen allow me to invite to the stage our panelists

Our dear speakers whom are undoubtedly the experts in their respective fields and together we’re going to pick their brain so ladies and Gentlemen please allow me to welcome our first panelists Miss Monica Huang on pre-sales on Envision digital let’s give her a big run of applause thank you very much Miss Huang

And uh I know that you hail from Singapore and uh I hope that you’re doing well today and jakarta’s treating you well thank you so much for joining us here today and ladies and gentlemen for our second panelists allow me to invite to the stage he’s the leader

Elite advisor of catalyst please welcome Dr David Mitchell [Applause] thank you very much Dr Mitchell for joining us here today yes and ladies and gentlemen we have two more great speakers joining us here today please welcome the president director of Pete Chandra sakti Utama lising Thank you very much thank you so much and last but not least ladies and gentlemen a very special special figure that’s undoubtedly been the driving force in our vehicle as well as Transportation industry please allow me to Welcome to the stage the chairman of guy kindo Mr Johannes

Dr Mitchell and Miss Huang thank you so much for joining us here today and for allowing us to pick your brain and learn so much from you we indeed have so much to talk about especially with regards to electric vehicles and the impact on our future battle ladies and gentlemen

Before I welcome our first uh speaker to present her presentation to us today allow me to tell you a little bit about her so ladies and gentlemen miss Monica Huang represents an Envision digital and Miss Huang is the principal consultant of pre-sales of Envision digital International ladies and gentlemen she’s

Incredibly passionate contributor to the energy transition mission in APAC with a proven track record in developing new business lines as well as opening new markets in both SME and MNC she has a comprehensive understanding of the commercial regulatory Financial Technical and digitalization aspects of the energy sector so without further Ado

Allow me to welcome Miss Huang to present her presentation let’s give her a big run of applause [Applause] explains what applying production um so I’ll just stand and make the presentation kind of work off the lunch right okay so um I’ll just wait for the slides to be up okay

Um so today I will present the view from the industry uh mostly from the EV charging part and a little bit on the recycling towards the end and also the consumer’s mentality all right so mix like this do we have the pickup all right so

Um for today I’ll focus on the global Ed sales share that we talk about the importance of availability of the EV itself because without the cars then there wouldn’t be any on the road then we’ll talk about the Chargers because unlike the internet internal combustion engine you have your petrol and Diesel

Infrastructure up now you need the Chargers and I think we spoke at length this morning about a judge transition which also links to affordability and I will end it off in to have this uh you know large deployment of electric vehicles you need an ecosystem it’s not just about the

Vehicle and not just about the Chargers so here is a quick snapshot of the electric car sales friend in some of the world’s largest Automotive sector and I have divided it into three different categories based on the GDP per capita so if we look on the most um

High income countries you can see that clearly the EV sales penetration has reached a significant level some of them going above 20 and yes indeed the government has played a big role in it now is this something that the lower income or kind of countries can emulate

We shall wait for the answer to be seen But if you look at the less than 10 000 US Dollars where we have the likes of Indonesia Brazil and in India actually Indonesia is faring pretty well at 1.5 based on the last data I saw in 2022 all right so in the

Sales of EV the trend is normally very very slow for a good number of years before you have a big spike okay okay but when does that Spike happen so to me it happens normally at the five percent so in this particular presentation I’m gonna focusing I’m

Gonna focus on the how do you jump start to get to that five percent and later on the market should work its magic right and fewer interventions is necessary as you could see in certain countries that have crossed that Mark such as uh China and Norway these two are probably the

Most advanced and sighted countries you can see that the government is already scaling back a lot of incentives both financial and non-monetary ones okay so um one of the characteristics that a lot of this High sales penetration country have is that they have the battery all the car manufacturing within their

Country so to my understanding Indonesia due to the large wealth in the Lego and some of the other rare earth materials there is a lot of investment coming in to the country to build the batteries itself and if historically you’re already a large Automotive manufacturing country so actually the elements are

Already here but how do we plan that transition so that as your production goes up you also have the demand locally to purchase those electric cars or electric bikes for the matter so a few years ago when I went into this industry they like to use the word

Chicken and egg which one should come first is it the car or the charging infrastructure right things like range anxiety the work gets thrown around a lot but after a few years of observation I would like to make my own little conclusion is that actually you’re giving birth to twins they have to

Happen at around the same time because if you don’t have them well balanced as you go along then it will not be a very successful and smooth transition so I use the two terms Double A’s one is availability and affordability so let’s start the availability part okay

The first five percent to Target who are they exactly um and I would like to maybe just uh quote or not really quote Elon Musk but uh his strategy of how he approached his own private Enterprise which is to target the people who will afford it and

It makes Financial sense for them to do it first which are the supercars it was only after a good number of years that they finally managed to have the Tesla Model 3 which is the mass Market model okay so now when we’ve like repositioned this at the national level so we do not

Expect people in the smaller towns or some of the not electric fight places to go easy no we definitely don’t expect that right so it’s it will be the first tier cities in Indonesia and even within the city um that are electric motorbikes which is already going pretty well but for today

I just focused on the electric car and heavier Vehicles so this will be your high income earners individuals and why then so to my limited understanding I think such higher wealth families they tend to own more than one car so if they need to go for long distance travel they can

Just easily lives to the petrol car instead of having the electric vehicle but in the day-to-day commute to work to the supermarket or a weekend Cinema getaway just pick up your electric car charge it back home because the range of the car is now touching 400 500 kilometer easily

And because they have their own house you can install the EV charger and have it charged overnight all right so just a rough sense of Time how long it takes to charge if you drive about 50 kilometers on average per day all right you only need to charge

Um after six days and each full charge for a car of 60 kilowatt hour or up to 100 kilowatt hour you would take around um about four or five hours to do a full charge at home okay so when you are sleeping your car can just continue to charge

Okay next segment is the taxi and right healing companies and why would they be motivated to do so it’s because of the ESG and the nice public relations publicity that comes along with it and because they can buy in bulk they can have a better price from the automotive sellers

And they are also in a better position to go to the financials the banks to ask for a green financing package to lower their cost of the purchase service is a little bit similar to the taxi so like your silver bird and the Goldbergs they serve more of the

Corporate customers and these corporate customers are less price sensitive and maybe they have to do a little bit of carbon reporting too for their trips so all these equal conscious decisions will allow them to pay a premium for this kind of electric car service

In fact when I was at the airport I saw that there were some Sitting Waiting booth for people who choose the electric car from the the bluebird or silverbird okay um and the other good thing about them is because the trips are booked in advance you can plan your charging

Schedule a little easier than as opposed to someone who is just driving randomly on the road okay then the next two are more for um the large corporate fleets where the last mile Logistics So Last Mile Logistics they usually stay within the city zone so and they will have a base

Which is the depot that they can go back to for a Top-Up and the company itself would invest in the charges for their own use so you don’t need to rely on public charging infrastructure that that’s giving you the anxiety of losing charge halfway all right um and then for the public transport

Buses that run on a fixed route it’s great for them because public transport is in itself very green all right and when you change it to battery it’s even Greener and why do I claim this so although I know that Indonesia still has a significant amount of Cobra production

But if we look at the efficiency of the vehicle the ice the internal combustion buses there are only about 20 to 40 percent efficient however for a battery itself it’s usually 80 to 90 percent efficient so when you do an end-to-end comparison of the carbon the battery is still more efficient

All right so iea has done a study on this and compared the vehicles so it is scientifically proven to be more lower carbon intensive okay so why do we need more EV models this is to drive choices for the segments that I showed you earlier especially for those um higher

Income individuals they want to have the ability to choose right so if you look at the Norway chart and the EV for Thailand you could see that the numbers definitely showed up in tandem with the numbers offered to them so it’s a two-way street when the sellers start to

See that interest is picking up they will push more models into the market and why do we want that because as I mentioned after the five percent Mark is hit usually the market should work by itself and that is because you have already generated the Baseline demand so more

Affordable costs will stop to come in so if you see for Thailand that has certainly happened where a lot of the Chinese electric vehicle models were introduced to the market all right um sometime in 20 20 21 and now they are one of the top sellers in the market

Okay availability of charges so who should be putting up the infrastructure right now in Indonesia pln has been mandated by the government to do it well I would suggest that actually the market should speak for itself the utility as you can see in a diverse different types of Market whether it’s a

High income Europe in Thailand or in Singapore they are a part but not the full picture you definitely have to engage the oil and gas sector which is already holding the relationships with the drivers the fleet owners to to go from oil and Diesel to electric vehicle charging at their petrol station

And after that they could diversify further and there will be others who belong more to people who are opportunistic investors or even startups with very innovative business models to come into the picture Okay so some of the charging installation business models in Singapore that have already taken place all right there is

No one-size-fit installation package it depends on the type of building and properties we are talking about if you are a single home owner it’s very different kind of consideration Factor for the industry buildings the single home owner they don’t care about smart charging or anything they just want a

Reliable charger that is not going to catch fire and do some annual maintenance work for the industrial buildings it’s more of okay they want the most price competitive fast charges and the charges are always in Tip Top condition because it’s for operational purposes let’s say if the public bus operators

Buy a charger they cannot afford the charges to be spoiled every week right it would be a nightmare for your your running of the roots okay and the total cost of ownership of EV has to eventually be on par with the combustion engine vehicles so there are two types of

Um like price parity one is total cost of ownership which is from the time you buy all the way to you stop using the car right so this includes the purchase price and the cost of electricity versus the cost of the oil and gas so the first one that usually breaks

Even first is the total cost all right because um unfortunately battery cars today are still generally more expensive without the subsidies so to help them with it we a lot of the different countries have came up with carrot and steak method so you give some incentives to the battery cost and you

Also put on more tax on the internal combustion engine vehicles okay then later on we talk about just the purchase price alone that should come from the market directly okay okay so um there is a study by the icct uh the clean counter of Transportation who measured extensively what is the

Cost to operate a diesel bus versus an electric bus in Jakarta so as you could see from here um looking at the taxes and fees they are payable actually the diesel bus is paying less right now so is this something that could be refined of this Tech structure

To at least make this on Palm or even lower right so I just want to end this up with the the whole ecosystem concept all right beyond the vehicles and charges we have other parts that must be addressed properly first we have the very important insurance I’m not too familiar with Indonesia but

At least in Singapore every car that goes on the road you must have a car insurance behind you if not you can’t bring out onto the public Road so insurance today they are also struggling to figure out how to price the premium so in Singapore if you drive

An electric car of similar power capacity your premium for a battery car is higher because data points for safety fire accident how much it costs to repair these are not available so in their risk management they just have to put in a higher premium but over time as they collect more

Information and data points we should expect a lowering of this premium and maybe even having some disruptors in the insurance space while willing to come up with innovative ideas the next one is the EV parts and components the car has a lot of parts right luckily battery car already has wave

Fewer than a petrol and diesel car but nonetheless these parts will eventually wear and tear and you need to replace them so the automotive workshops around the whole country but starting with the major cities they need to learn how to repair the vehicle in case it’s boys so training and upskilling is required

And what the Singapore government has done in this is to partner the private sector the training institutes to come up with programs to um train the technicians who do the actual work of fixing and certifying them to make sure they do the right thing yeah EV inspection and Servicing

So this is where you have to check once in a while whether the vehicle is still in good condition so it is true that battery if not handled properly can be a fire hazard all right but Automotive great batteries are super stringent Etc nonetheless we should still pay

Attention to ensure they go for regular inspections the next one is use EB Trading so um the good thing about second-hand car trading Market is they help to bring down the purchase value of the car so that you can go to the next level of the income group people

That day can then also come on board the EV Journey right if if you’re always having to buy a new car the premium is sometimes too much for them okay financing Institutes usually at the purchase Point how do you encourage green financing and Green Loans um do you want the differentiate between

The higher power cars or the mass market car so all these financing packages has to kick in and also sales purchase model nowadays there are those companies that don’t sell the full car to you they just sell you the vehicle chases with the shell but the battery belongs to them right so

This will effectively lower the cost of purchase by 40 50 percent and lastly research and training institutes they are necessary to continuously improve the battery technology so that the range which today is a 500 but few years ago they were only at 200 plus so you can see that

With continuous better Improvement you will see safer and higher energy Battery Systems and of course cooler cars all right so yeah that’s the end of my presentation thanks thank you very much Mr Monica Huang for the excellent very insightful presentation uh thank you very much for sharing your great insights and your

Expertise on the energy transition as well as its progress and ladies and gentlemen I’d like to remind you that after all of our speakers or presentations we’re also going to hold a panel uh discussions a q a session therefore for those of you who would like to ask questions please do not

Hesitate to just raise your hand and then our organizers and are going to hand over the mics to you and please tell us your name as well as your affiliation your institution and then whom your questions is directed to be it a Miss Huang Dr Mitchell or Baba

Johannes so ladies and gentlemen allow me to tell you a little bit about our next speaker to present his presentation uh ladies and gentlemen he represents Catalyst prospera as the lead advisor of Market integration he was previously an advanced manufacturing and Services advisor and established under the Indonesia Australia comprehensive

Economic partnership agreements economic cooperation program or the IAC PA ECP catalyst is a 540 million US Dollars government-backed business development program unlocking the vast potential of economic partnership between Australia and Indonesia and he’s a senior executive an innovator and entrepreneur delivering strategic organizational change and complex technosocial environments so without further Ado it

Is with great honor for us to welcome on stage Mr David Mitchell to present his presentation let us give him a big round of applause [Applause] thank you thank you very much I feel I’ve been oversold and I see my LinkedIn profile has been scraped

Um I’d like to thank Monica for a really excellent talk because she’s set up the sort of things that I want to talk about and she’s also stolen my first two slides but I’m I’m very pleased to see that actually they align so I’d like to talk a little bit about the

Ecosystem but first of all I need to talk about the philosophy the first thing that we or that I would like to impart to you is that electric vehicles aren’t really a one-for-one like for like replacement with petrol cars your existing petrol car will not get a software upgrade every three to five

Months for the rest of its life it’ll be like my last car where I went into the service guys after about five years and said do you think we could do a map update and they said sure we can buy the CD from Audi it’ll be 950 dollars

I said it’s fine I’ve got Google Maps on the phone whereas all new cars have automatic update they’re connected to the air all the time so when you’re thinking about battery life just be aware that you’ll be getting a BMS update every year or two years and

So your battery will be being looked after with technology that’s been written in five years time not that was written three years ago and the next thing I would say is that this is not a transition transitions imply coordination and control things that are very highly regarded in Indonesian culture

This Is A disruption this is coming like a tsunami it can’t be controlled it will just happen to you and it will mostly be good but that implies tipping points and things breaking and sometimes it’ll feel like things break and sometimes you won’t be ready for the Tipping Point

But my message is is that there will be one and recognize it when it comes and the other thing is about people in the room and you did a bit of an interactive thing before so I might do one now how many people here own an electric vehicle put your hand up

None and look that’s not unexpected in Indonesia oh is there one excellent thank you two what what you have you build one excellent oh an electric motorcycle uh gojek model District or a big one and modelistic excellent so when you are talking to each other you’ve no real experience

You don’t really know you’ve never owned one you’ve never plugged one in you caught one to the airport it was very quiet but all of the things that you think about you naturally worry oh what what what will happen if this if the battery just runs flat will I make the range

So you are operating in an absence of contemporary information and this is very challenging when the sector is moving very fast and what happens is is that the predominant source of knowledge are the incumbents and with a lot of respect to the incumbents they’re not all that interested in being disrupted

They would much prefer a transition with control where their assets are managed not an awful event and all of a sudden their Factory is completely stranded very bad for business and the last thing I would say is that the transition will be demand LED and Monica made a really good point about chicken

Or Rick it’s got to be demand LED it starts slow and here is the five percent slide which is absolutely right so this is from Bloomberg 19 countries in the world have passed five percent I looked on Twitter the other day it’s now 23 and last month 20 of new car

Sales in the world were Electric so the future is here but it’s just unevenly distributed so what does that mean for Indonesia in Indonesia five percent of new sales for motorcycles is about seven hundred thousand motorcycles a year so we’re not really close to that yet

But we might be there next year or maybe the year after and if we’re there next year then in four years based on what we expected in other markets with cars which is slightly different so Indonesia might go faster in the two-wheel Market or it might go slower

25 percent of new sales three and a half million multi listric a year would be sold well before the end of the decade that would be a substantial disruption cars are different about 20 million passenger vehicles in Indonesia about the same as Australia a million years sold 50 000 is five percent

I suspect it won’t be too long before we get there the way willing and Hyundai are pumping them out so now let’s talk about charging infrastructure and of course when people talk to you about charging infrastructure they talk about the negatives will the Greek cope what about pln aren’t they meant to put

All the charges up who’s going to pay really important question I’m happy to pay for the electricity but I don’t want to pay for the charger and then what happens if everybody comes home plugs in at once and the grid breaks now seriously this is what the guys that

Run Grid in Queensland were saying to me three or four years ago oh but we we can’t have which I’ve just let anybody put anything they want in their house like what happens if everybody comes home at the same time mate seriously so I always think it’s important to have a

Prop so I bought one on who knows what this is I don’t know what the sign language guys are going to say when they say this do you think plugging these in is going to break the grid do you think everybody is going to come

Home at the same time and drive it here no so why don’t we have a think about charging electric cars with the concept of the hair dryer equivalent so when you want to think about plugging your car in don’t think about plugging a car in think about plugging a hairdryer in

This is courtesy of my hotel it’s called the black Mambo and I hope it’s going to get home in one piece ah shocker so here is my favorite car in Indonesia the whirling air and I’m going to do some very simple numbers for you and the most important thing to

Understand is that it’s a 700 watt hairdryer the black Mambo’s 1875 by the way I just blow your head off okay so a whirling air uses 85 watt hours per kilometer per kilometer that’s its efficiency if you like it’s a small car a bigger car like an ionic 5

Would probably use 180 to 200 so you might get five kilometers per kilowatt hour and a modalist rick probably uses somewhere down around 20. because they have a one 1.1 kilometer a kilowatt hour battery and they get about 50 K’s so and that’s mostly related to weight and and distance

So let’s say you drive your ruling air 100 kilometers per day 100 kilometers times 85 watt hours is eight thousand five hundred eight and a half kilowatt hours which is about the size of the battery in my old plug-in hybrid so how many hours would it take you to charge and as

You can see whirling it just plugs into a plug it doesn’t need a special charger just any wall outlet will do so if you can get access to a three pin plug you can charge your car in the same way you can use your hair dryer so to recharge 100 kilometers will take

About 12 hours at hairdryer speed so do you think a few thousand rulings coming home is going to break the grid do you think a few thousand hair dryers is going to break the no now if you use the full two kilowatts out of the outlet about four and a half hours

So for the sort of Indonesian style car the whirlings that we see all of the time around in Jakarta that they there is no charging infrastructure required buy a double adapter but when you get it home just plug it in like you do at night with your phone I mean mostly you’re asleep

So now let’s do a modalistic example so these are actual photos that I took uh nearly 12 months ago and one of the nice things about modalistic in Indonesia is that they have uh there’s a battery swapping mode so if you buy a smooth you can charge with swap

And here is a cabinet it holds eight batteries they’re each about 1.1 kilowatt hours whoops a left off the H my bad and because you swap and because their business model is just linked to the number of kilometers you drive not to what the battery is charged swap you swap as

Often as you like so I’m assuming that you swap at thirty percent empty or full and that it only has to get to 80 and you’d be happy to take one and put it in your in your bike so I only have to put 550 Watt hours

In each of those batteries and if the whole cabinet was full at our hair dryer equivalent about six hours and on the right that is the plug that was how it was plugged in round the back I went and took a photo of it so if you’re worried about charging

Infrastructure do you really think that there aren’t enough power boards in Indonesia to plug in and I have another picture at an endo Merit not of an eight by one but a three by one and it is on a double adapter with the drinks fridge out the front so

For the next year or two you really don’t have to worry very much about the charging infrastructure in Indonesia you’ve got a great grid could it be more resilient yes of course there’s more in the jamali jamali grid Palin already has too much power they would love a few people to buy electric

Vehicles and plug them in so I’m just going to finish up with a little comment on the batteries Supply always follows demand the demand for Batteries is enormous and in 2022 globally there was already over a terawatt hour of production capacity in 2018 the same people thought that

This level of capacity would be reached in 2028 it was reached last year and by about 2027 we expect close to eight to nine terawatts of capacity there there are Supply challenges but there are no Supply fatal flaws this will be a demand lead this will go fast and it will be unexpected

And unexpected things will happen and we’ll need to adapt thank you very much thank you very much uh Dr David Mitchell for the excellent very insightful presentation and thank you very much for delivering it in a way that helps us all of us here to understand a little more

And a little better on this a pretty complex subject and uh ladies and gentlemen uh next before I welcome our Nexus speaker to present is the presentation allow us to tell you a little bit about him so ladies and gentlemen what an incredible figure uh Mr swandi viratno will be delivering a

Presentation on behalf of appr or the Indonesia Financial Services Association as of March 2012. Mr swandi has led CS UL finance a leasing company owned by trakindo which engages in the financing various types of heavy equipments owned by caterpillar Komatsu kobelto kobelco Hitachi techs and many more with total

Assets managed as of December 2012 reaching around 300 170 million dollars so without further Ado allow me to welcome swandi to present his presentation let us give him a big round of applause thank you Amelia we have two great great Seekers Monica and David well um this um I’ll speak about the financing

Opportunities on electric financing but before I start with my presentations probably I’ll speak about a little bit of history of the financing company in Indonesia we’ve been serving the market of financings in Indonesia since 1975. our present has been 48 years we started with a leasing businesses back in 1975 till 1990s then

We started to actually financing three high cost with cars first and then motorcycles in 1995. we grow a business uh very fast since the year of 2000 or Y2K and the financings of vehicle has been actually the majority of our portfolio the portfolio of the financings company today’s some amounted about

485 trillion rupiah that is an on balance sheet on and off balance it will be around 1500 trillion rupiah and some 65 percent of those are from the vehicles financings let’s continue with the presentations um can anyone help oh here okay okay when we look at the composition

Based on financing’s object if you look at I just now talk about the financing portfolio a water consumptions Goods consumption goods are comprising of four wheelers two-wheelers use and new and also electric financing and if you look at those 68 at the consumption goods and 27 are the productive Goods so the

Productive goods are actually comprising of Transportation logistic trucks heavy equipments and some other productive Goods like machineries industrial machineries and others and of those uh compositions of businesses than some close to 82 percent are actually or 92 percent are actually more on four wheelers new and used

Two wheelers new and used and a bit of consumption Goods like electronic and first use residents and all of this product as well so if you look at our our portfolio financings are really related to vehicles financings so today we talk about electric vehicles Save the Planet of electric vehicles and

Indonesia is a very serious to actually going to go for green financings and environmental friendly David has actually had good comments on whether electric vehicle is the only one of actually changing the ice Monica has also talked about EVs and Indonesia 47 transportation is the biggest contributor for air pollution in

Jakarta and West Java this is the factual and again I think Indonesia’s are very blessed because we have nickel of battery and 48 60 are actually from nickel and lithium and we have it here in Indonesia and the price of the battery itself again I think it’s around

25 40 percent of the price of an electric vehicles through the regulations of the government regulations on number 55 2019 acceleration of battery electric vehicle program for Road transportation is already there and Ministry of Industry regulation also has done a development of roadmap of electric vehicle and condition of calculating domestic

Component level values for battery based electric motorcycles Vehicles here are some facts on how Indonesia is a very serious going through green financing going through changing our behaviors from an engine based cars into electric cars but let’s take a look on some of the issues of electric vehicles itself we all understand electric

Vehicles just now the research has said that environmental friendly minimal pollution and carbon emission and do not use fuel that is the comment of many people the operational issues also charging costs are much cheaper as what David is saying than Phil maintenance costs are cheaper because you don’t have engine any longer you

Only have battery in the cars or the motorcycles in terms of avoidability availability of spare part and charging station is starting to be available especially in the big city but it’s still challenging because you know government needs to build more charging stations tax costs as you all understand that

Indonesian government’s first year tax subsidy and much cheaper on annual tax tax incentive is there as well and Mobility again I think why people buy cars and electric cars in a big city like Jakarta because you don’t have you don’t actually need to have two cars especially going through a CBD area

Because odd and even numbers are actually free of those these are some advantages now let’s go back again on the car sales uh in Indonesia since the year of 2005 the year of 2023 as the automotive industry grown our business also grown we built we actually grow together with the

Automotive industry since the year of 2000 and the uh the sales of cars has actually grew up to a level of 1.2 million in the year of 2013 and somehow has actually flat in terms of the growth between a number of a million one and point one million unit the year of 2020

Because of coffee the sales of cars actually has gone down to a level of 530 000 and then has gone up back to a level of a million unit and million 48 000 in the year of 2022 and I have actually been asked by many reporters what do I think about

The car’s sales in the near one or two years after the coffee situation and I said people of Indonesia has the uh you know the culture to change cars between four to five years and I think with that concept the sales of cars and motorcycles will always grow and there

Will be always a need of people changing the car and sales their cars into a used car so these are going to be our businesses the opportunity for us to do business and now let’s okay let’s take a look on motorcycle itself motorcycle the capacity installed in Indonesia is 10 million units the

Highest sales we have ever actually reached was 8 million units in the year of 2011 but then that has gone down to a level to the lowest I think was 4.3 million a year of 2020 because of coffee situation and now has gone back to the

Level of I think this year the sales of motorcycle May reach around 6 million unit this is actually in line with the demography bonus of the people of Indonesia we have 260 million people and the needs of transportation is there because we are still lacking of the uh public transportations as we all

Understand the government is is actually speeding up in terms of building up the public transportations not only in the big city but all surrounding cities all across Indonesia so in terms of sales of the cars and motorcycle itself the needs of financing Indonesia is very high the

Needs of financing for cars I think the ratio 70 when people buy cars it has to go to financings and for motorcycles would be somewhere around 80 to 90 percent so these are the opportunity for financings of cars and motorcycles in Indonesia so let’s stick let’s discuss about the needs of

Opportunity to financing electric cars Are We There Yet yes we have had financings but the the numbers are pretty much very small today the reasons why it is small against I think it all depends on the market itself why people really want to buy an electric vehicles

But as a financing company we do have concern as well on financing electric vehicles first and foremost Our concern is about the result value of the electric vehicle itself because when the customer defaulted we need to actually repossess the cars and and the motorcycles and is there any uh sort of

Like Market people buying the resale uh the the use of the car itself in the motorcycles it is yet challenged on that because there aren’t any repossessed I said today because people who who buys cars uh and electric cars and motorcycles today are actually the good

One because you know not all people want to buy electric cars as at today because this is not a big Mass market yet uh let’s try to compare on gasoline cars and electric cars itself the number of sales the results of of our offices on the in the association

We can still see that the gasoline car is still dominating the sales I mean it’s still on progress uh in line with you know the government is actually now uh trying to speed up the the building of the infrastructures of the charging station itself even on the motorcycles I

Think it’s still small numbers of units are being sold now let’s take a look of electric car itself just now on the risk on the survey that Amelia has done it’s actually there are a lot of answers of electric cars was you know they’re talking about bullying Hyundai Tesla

This is what comes into our mind now let’s take a look on the on those uh car itself yes there are a lot of Brands now offering electric cars nice and everything is you know the government giving a lot of subsidy on the taxis and

A lot of uh uh those kind of things I think you know for us as a finance company we have to actually also discussing with the insurance associations in Indonesia Monica has talked about insurance needs to be placed in Singapore when people buy cars and when people want to buy cars through

Credit Indonesia also the risk mitigation by the regulation insurance has to be in place as well and uh when we discuss with the Insurance Association we had had some difficulty deal with the insurance companies because the insurance premium itself has not been calculated by the insurance associations because they’ve discussed

With us and they said that the uh how would you actually want to ensure the car itself when you talk about engine you could actually insert and cover all risks because when things happen with the engine that can be actually uh you know uh paid up you know when the engine is

Broken but on these issues on on on the battery itself the battery is something that will be going on and then usable at certain States they’ll be that and again I think the Insurance Association are still calculating and doing a lot of research and everything you know we’re still waiting for them to

Actually uh you know giving us the the rate of of the electric vehicles as at today they’re still using the insurance premium the same with the engine cars this is what they’re they’re giving us the quotations again I think uh has all the two speakers you know Monica has talked

About the plug-in hybrid vehicles talking about the electric vehicles the uh engine based Vehicles the sales of those vehicles are actually still growing but growing at the very slow pace but most electric vehicles are priced more than 600 million and of those electric vehicles 40 percent of

Those are actually the price of the battery itself so 60 will be the body and uh that is the two components if you look at it the battery and the body itself public electric vehicle the challenge is on charging stations the charging stations there aren’t a lot as

Uh as all the two speakers were talking about money uh you know the this the electric vehicles I said today I think it’s been used only for City cars but if you want to travel much longer uh longer journey I think you still needs to use your engine car space because you

Know sometimes people are afraid where are we going to find the charging stations because there aren’t a lot of charging station as of today and I know government is now preparing to actually building the charging stations and and again I think we still can charge it at

Home but this is what I heard if you buy a motorcycle’s electric cars you need 900 watts of electricity and majority of our customers that is actually buying motorcycles maybe in their house they only have 450 Watts they need to actually upscale the install more what’s for even charging it

But that will be only for the motorcycles the car itself also in Indonesia to charge cars it needs about 6 000 watts of of electricity this is what what people are saying but I think again I think there are a lot of things needs to be to be uh

Uh discuss and to be uh talk about and and and really give the solutions on that because you know at the end of the day uh you need a lot of things to be uh solved on some of these infrastructures so so much of that I think electric

Vehicles we are ready to finance but again I think there are some certain issues still needs to be solved like limited charging stations expensive selling price of the sales guarantee include battery or not the battery availability last but not least is the battery West handling people has not

Talked about you know when the battery dies you know where are all this battery is going to go because the the waste handling itself needs to be taken care because it will be some environmental issues also in the near futures of the batteries that so service life quality and durability

Electric car designs Indonesia more into five seaters because Indonesian people love all these uh people can fit in into one car we call it you know all people can fit in like seven nine seat is better and I I wish I think the more model comes like seven or nine seaters

To fit all the families into one car and the uncertainty selling price of used vehicle I’ve talked about it there are no insurance and guarantee on products for electric vehicles yet but I think through times we are discussing it and I hope there will be Solution on all

Of these issues as you all understand as a financing company when the business is there the demand is there we are ready to do that so Milestone of electric vehicle financing by finance company within one year we need to collaborating with dealers which produce Electrical Products just now I

Heard there is one uh producers on cars electric motorcycles or cars collaborating with insurance company for electric car protections risk transfer products selective Finance electric cars asset today three to five years we will accelerate electric car financing while still paying attention to Quality so that portfolio grows healthily because

Our business is about quality of the portfolio we do not want to end up with non-performing financing because we don’t make money we need quality portfolio we need good customers over the last five years more than five years we will maintain financing for electric car and start entering financing for Upstream industry

For electric-based vehicles because we are going to go there and I think last but not least this will be my annual presentations so for financing company I have a jargon called wife wife is wise investment forever and I hope all electric cars and electric motorcycle will be our wife

Which is wise investment forever thank you so much thank you very much Baba swandi for the excellent presentation and the great insights undoubtedly Illuminating this panel discussion on the subject of our EV or electric vehicles and its progress and transition and uh ladies and gentlemen of course uh with Baba

Swandisa presentation especially on how it relates to Indonesia this undoubtedly so much to talk about and uh before we start our q a session ladies and gentlemen allow me to present to you our next speaker he hails from the association of the Indonesian automotive industry allow me to tell you a little

Bit about him so ladies and gentlemen our beloved Baba Johannes nangoi will be delivering a presentation on behalf of guy Kindle as a general chair of guy kindo or the association of Indonesia’s Automotive Industries he has long emphasized the importance as a strategic partner of the Indonesian government and

Continuously encouraging the growth of Indonesia’s automotive industry and the guy kindo will continue to achieve better achievements and results by striving to increase exports and make Indonesia an export base and also by creating vast distribution of Automotive Products and information throughout Indonesia so without further Ado ladies

And gentlemen let us give the biggest run of Applause for Baba Johannes nangoi thank you Amelia so good and gentlemen it’s a very honor for me to speak in front of here and when I joined this seminars is really very happy with the title of the seminar which is actually saved the planet

But I have a very good news that save the planet electric car is only just one solution there are still many solutions beside the ones so we can save the planet without the solution as well together with the electric car itself so let me start with my presentations

Before I start let me introduce my associations which is actually we are very concentrating in the automotive business so Indonesia at this moment we are number 11 in producing the vehicle in the world so we are increasing from number 14 to becoming number 11 and number 15 to

Number 11s and then uh we are very confident that within the short times maybe next or the next two years we will be in the 10th biggest country in the world that produce vehicle what I mean by vehicle is cars and both common uh uh combustion engine and the electric

Vehicle as well and in asean Market we are number one in terms of Market but in the world we are number 14. yeah just right behind Australia but mostly of our product is actually we produce in Indonesia we only importing less than 75 000 cars a year and we are

Exporting almost 500 000 cars so basically Indonesia we are already self-sufficient and we can produce our cars in country uh maybe this one actually already being touched by Parts 1D that this is actually the conditions that um in the 2020 is actually a disaster for us

Can you imagine that almost 95 000 to 100 000 cars we sell every month and in 2020 in may we only selling about 5 000 cars a band dropped by 95 that’s why that we try to recover the markets and fortunately in 2022 our performance is even much better

Comparing to before the profit itself you know so we are touching one million uh 40 something thousands which is actually a little bit higher comparing 2019. okay and this year uh hopefully that basically our Market can be also at least similar or even slightly bigger than last year but

You have to also to check that basically our export is doing well I will explain a little bit on that one okay with about 1.5 workers working for us in the automotive Industries and we are exporting more than 90 countries in the world so we are exporting on that

Once so not only to underdeveloped country but if you go to Japan you will see also many cars that basically made in Indonesia running theirs in Japan uh here is it so in until year to date August our Productions is actually increasing by three percent

But the export is increasing by 18 so if you see up to August year to date 2023 our export is already 337 000 while the full year into 2022 we are exporting about 285 thousands so Indonesia is put itself actually as a major player in exporting the cars around the world and

We are going to achieve 1 million cars by 2027. this is actually what the government expecting that Indonesia can be coming the playing or the major player Automotive in the world the background of all this thing is actually coming when the our president is actually committing in the Paris agreement

They say that basically to reduce the 29 of carbon by 2030 and then coming to Net Zero emission by 2060. okay so cars is always being pointed as a biggest contributions of the emission but let me explain uh we can do much better on these things in the Futures if we work together

Especially some peoples in Jakarta are complaining that basically Jakarta becoming the worst polluted city in the world but let’s discuss what they want we already have this one Indonesian trend is actually we’re going to go to the green Mobility yeah we have the steps to go there but

Automotive industry is not producing the fuel the fuel is actually coming from the government as well so we need also that basically a clean fuel coming from the government okay and then we’re going to go not only for the combustion engine but we’re going to have as well the hybrid the

Electric vehicle or even the hydrogain or the others for example like the biofuels uh engines vehicle then can adopt multiple engine multiple uh gasoline as well actually it’s ethanol this one flexi engine is actually the Futures on this one so we have now is actually the

Low cost green card and then we have the hybrid plug-in hybrid battery electric vehicle but in the future or as as out of now we also have the biofuel as well with the flexi engine that we can adopt the diesel oil combined with the palm oil 35 this one is actually reduced to

Pollution because the palm oil doesn’t have any sulfur so it’s actually it’s a cleaner one this is only Indonesia who can achieve 35 the highest in the other country outside Indonesia is only seven percent so we have to appreciate all these things what the government done to us we already have 35 percent

Okay we just going to compare this with Brazil uh the next week the Brazil delegation will come to Indonesia to discuss with us about this one because Brazil is actually using the ethanol from the sugar cane so Indonesia is going to utilize more on the palm oil we

Are we are in the export and the leaders of these things okay uh and look at this one Indonesia we already achieving the Euro for Euro Forest actually is a categories which is actually quite clean the the use of everything’s actually is actually we have a very uh good one but unfortunately

The gasoline or the diesel oil that being used here is not matched with that one so it seems like that I’m asking by the government to produce a a glass for Waters but basically I already make us a clean one but the water is actually it’s a

Dirty water so whoever drink the water from the glass the result is actually will not be good for example that the diesel oil that’s still being used to keep the chip diesel oil our regulations say that basically the maximum sulfur is must be 50 50 du means basically cannot be existed one

But nowadays it’s actually even 500. or sometimes actually even more one thousands okay that’s why uh the Jakarta especially with this kind of a very active people and we hike us around the city then the pollution is very high even though we only s by mentioned in basically only 40 44 the

Rest is actually that these things look at Tokyo more people more vehicle and in Tokyo almost all is actually using gasoline but they are very tight and the result is actually very clean environment as well okay government is concentrating on how to give an incentive of the electric

Vehicle Indonesia will do the same thing as well Australia for example that they are giving uh incentive to 2500 US Dollars discount of the important tax Indonesia is keeping the value at the tax from 11 to 1 percent only for the battery electric vehicle okay if we Market potential in Indonesia

We have to see the Democratic first the biggest Market in Indonesia is actually 300 million rupiah cars but with one condition at least must be an MPV that actually the cars can carry four to five peoples you cannot sell a small cars here with only carry two people plus additional

Very small seat for two peoples because it’s actually two small cars the there can be sell but basically volume will not be that high okay so if you’re looking at this one it must be around three million 300 million or below 200 million 300 million the market is going to be big

So as a result you can see here that uh the price is actually still very high and then the result the battery electric vehicle last year we are selling ten thousand almost ten thousand three hundred up to August we only selling about nine thousand but if you’re looking at the result of

The hybrid hybrid last year it’s actually we are selling about ten thousands you need and this year we are already selling 30 000 unit and if you use hybrid right away you’re going to reduce the pollution because the use of the gasoline is going to be decreased okay regarding the electric vehicle I

Agree that electric vehicle is going to be the futures of our vehicle but the infrastructures must be solved first like the gasoline car not cannot be alone must be supported by the government with the cleaner gasoline because we introduced Euro 4 Euro five but the gasoline is Euro two not use steel pollution

It seems when you use the electric car but the electric car is actually common coming from the core then we’ll not solve the problem and you have to remember after we use the electric vehicle or battery electric vehicle the used battery is actually very dangerous if we

Are not taking care of that one very well okay so uh that’s the technician less the researchers less the market make the choice and choose the futures of our Future car business futurecast business will not be depends on somebody else but middle depends on the researchers on how we can produce a

Cheap car clean car and definitely that basically is a suitable with the market requirement so hopefully in the future we’re going to have the kind of vehicle so I’ll be looking at this one until year to date of August that the total battery electric including uh hybrid and plug-in hybrid is about

39 000 while the total sales is already 670 five thousand so it’s about five to six percent is coming to go there it’s good but we still need to do the much improvement but don’t forget that beside the battery we have the combustion engine that can adapt

With the biofuel which is actually going to give us cleaner environment with that one I end my presentations so the conclusion is actually beefy vehicle is still the Futures and the development is still requires more fiscal incentive and then they all if it analogy are given to be the part of the

Development program because all can play a role in reducing emission okay reduce the price difference between Ife and ice between electric vehicle and combustion engine increase the availability of supporting infrastructures or a dimension paper that basically we need to have the charging stations already mentioned about this one

Reducing the cost of doing business and simplifying the process for setting up companies that are including the b e v value chain and acquisition in Indonesia in order to build the industry of the battery electric vehicle cars in the futures so with that one is actually I’m ending my presentations

Thank you so much what an excellent presentation thank you very much for imparting your great knowledge especially on representing the association of the Indonesian automotive industry to all of us and uh ladies and gentlemen there we have it what a great great session thank you very much to all of our speakers for

Illuminating this great panel discussion with your great insights and I guess uh allow me to ask the questions to our uh speakers first before I open the floor and then allow everyone to please for those of you who like to uh ask questions do not hesitate to just raise

Your hand tell us your name and about you and your affiliations and your institutions and then also to whom you present uh your question is presented to uh well I guess my first question I will be at to uh Dr Mitchell Dr Mitchell after listening to the great

Presentations of um our other uh panelists and especially on the Baba Johannes whom had a emphasized the in the importance especially when we talk about the infrastructure of a TV’s ecosystem the GOI had uh implemented and also introduced the uh EV acceleration program since 2019 and um with uh Baba

Johanna’s uh emphasizing the importance and uh currently the insufficient uh incentives compared to what we have today do you think it is sufficient at the implementations of the regulations as well as the um incentives that we have today thank you very much that’s a that’s a very interesting question

One of the most important things about climate change or reducing the effects of climate change is that we go fast and incentives help us go faster so you know my answer is we could always have more incentives but it’s it’s always challenging for governments to put put incentives in

Place I I think one of the great incentives that that we have at the moment is is the blue number plate and the mobility of the odd even days I think that’s why I see so many whirlings zipping around on Jalan cerdeman during peak times and I don’t think you there are definitely

Different costs EVS are more expensive and as Monica says so you start selling them to the people who have the ability to pay that money and then it all trickles down from there but I think in the two-wheel EV Market we’re already seeing that cost of ownership

For the cheaper end of the modalistrict market is already on comparison with ice and they are much cheaper to run they’re much cheaper to run thank you very much uh David for your answer and uh Miss Huang after listening to all of the other presentations on emphasizing

How 2020 was not a good year for the automotive industry as sales had plummeted and what Dr Mitchell had emphasized is that when it comes to fighting climate change acting fast speed and efficiency are the keys to success and After experiencing we’ve all experienced the pandemic what do you

Think we have learned especially with regards to the transition of new energy so I think one of the few nice effects of the pandemic was that people started commenting oh the air is fresh all right so I think yes the the quality of the petrol does matter but the fact is they

Still emit carbon and some other pollutants alongside rivets such as the um the socks and the knocks and so forth so I would say that emerging from the pandemic there are also certain countries because they needed to stimulate their economy they had to make a decision at that point in time

How to stimulate the economy and if we see the European Union and by the administration they decided to bet on clean energy and I said I use the word clean energy and not electric vehicle because rightly so this transition must come in a holistic manner without the clean energy

Part just the electric vehicle alone is insufficient and under clean energy there’s also the recycling piece and so recycling of the battery is indeed an upcoming business um and just a little nugget of fun fact we like to think that the recycling comes at the end of the battery life

Which is when the car gets decommissioned but in fact majority of the batteries getting recycled today are coming from your Consumer Electronic Goods like your laptop and mobile phone and from the battery manufacturing site because you can’t meet the automotive grade and you need to scrap them and

Take back the raw material to manufacture again so we don’t have to wait till your cars get decommissioned it’s already happening without you knowing it thank you very much and uh thank you very much for your great insights especially on the what happens after covet and there is the silver lining in

All of that Andy especially now we talk about from the infrastructure of the e-visa ecosystem and now base to uh to financing and papa you’re definitely the expert to talk about that um on EVS financing what do you think is the most prominent challenge that these financiers are um talking about or

Experiencing today in the world of iev and in your opinion is there any quick win-win solution for that challenge and what kind of support do you think is needed to make the process easier well I well I think hello okay um again I think with the financing opportunities

Um it’s going to be a big Market it’s just a matter of literacy this is about educations as you all understand that the the big Market in Indonesia’s take an example of motorcycles I think the only country that motorcycles are being used for a long journey and especially

During the labaran idol fitri they take the motorcycles from Jakarta to Java and I think there aren’t any countries they take motorcycles a long journey like that and and and people you know when they want to buy electric vehicles they’ll be a testing period you know whether these electric vehicles can be

Actually used for along Journeys so when that confident level is increased the market will come along with that and and and there is no doubt that we need to actually goes into this clean energies because you know the needs are already there because you know after coffee the whole situations we all

Understand that you know everyone needs needs a really clean environments you know clean energy you know clean everything uh you needs to be it needs to be changed but the matters is about education and literacies and about the ecosystems like what Johannes nango is talking about because you know

Businesses they are risk mitigation needs to be in place because Regulators wants to make sure that the quality of financing is that the people that actually buy cars and motorcycles there won’t be any High delinquents on that because you know we actually not wanting any repossessions of the vehicle

Itself what we want that are going to be paid you know the you know what the loans are going to be paid and everything’s you know the key questions on us on our part on financings is about uh these educations are delivered in the right time and the right moment uh as as

You all understand that the governments are doing their uh efforts very hard you know giving love and incentive you know because the price of motorcycles today 15 million they’re given even 7 million subsidy or 8 million subsidy and the price is going to be like seven eight

Millions you know uh this is some things that we have been working together with ojeka and the governments on on educating people to really wanting to to change their motorcycle from the engine engine base into the electric base but nevertheless it’s still an effort to do all these things but as a

Financing company will have to be ready because you know at the end of the day we will follow the market business is there for us because our business is about financing it’s not about buying cars it’s not about buying motorcycles getting a good quality customers getting a good quality uh

You know cars and motorcycles on electric side you know today we’re talking about electric we don’t know in the Futures we’ve been we’ve been you know we’ve been we heard about this Hydro concept that’s being developed by the Japanese you know you never know you

Know there’ll be a lot of more to come in terms of uh you know the world is already talking about clean energy and I think there will be no other way to move back it’s just to move forward in term of clean energy thank you very much Papa so Andy and

Baba Johannes are seeing that confidence truly is very much needed in the uh adaptation and the adoption of the Visa ecosystem and how Dr Mitchell had also previously emphasized on the importance of the general population to get the confidence of EVS or electric vehicles um from the chart that you’ve shown us

Previously is that um e-visa sales have not been um as great as all the other sales of other vehicles and my question for you is what do you think are the incentives that are most needed to push for the sales of EV so uh against one things before we start

With their ones that based on my experience meeting with the other Automotive associations in the world there is one indication there is no single Solutions you know they’re going to be multiple solutions for example like Indonesia is very different with other country if we’re talking about for example with

Singapore you know Indonesia is a very wide country and then uh to transfer for example that the cigarette from kadiri gudangaram to Medan you can use electric vehicle over this you know it’s too long so as I understood also also in in Australia to carry the meat from from

For example Melbourne to Sydney whatever you can carry the one using the electric truck because it actually is too too risky when the everything the electric is dropped and the condition is dropped all is actually gone you know and then you cannot easily to adapt all those

Things so there is no single solution so far okay in Indonesia we can use the electric vehicle yes so part of the solutions on the ones why we can use the electric vehicle for the city cars we can use the electric vehicle for the commercial for example for the bus the

Which is actually with the very fixed route that they’re going to be used like a trans Jakarta or whatever you know but for the long journey for the other things we can still use the combustion engines but we give the other solution on that one for example that using the

Biofuel or whatever which is actually recycles uh fuels on the ones yeah so if you’re asking me how to basically increase it once Market will judge this once price is actually very important Indonesian Market is actually the biggest part is below 300 million if there is a battery electric vehicle

Which is actually fast to be charged and can be used longer time to drive and then with at least five seaters MP5 type of vehicle SUV then definitely the market public co-ops so all those things actually incentive yes you can you can give it but incentive is actually

When you give the incentive and the price can go down up to the level which is actually the demand of the most majority Indonesian people that can be good but by giving 11 to 1 which is actually ten percent for Ionic for example from 800 somethings then you

Drop about 80 million so it’s going to be 700 somethings also the market will not be that big so in these things actually the technology is still improving I still believe electric vehicle will be the Futures but against we have to consider as well there is no single solution so

Far for the military military vehicle you cannot use the electric vehicles you know yeah like when I discussed this one in Germany Germany said no no no no no no no no military trucks cannot use the electric vehicle so far okay because when you go to the Jungle you don’t know where to

Charge wherever you know so you still use anything okay so it’s a multiple Solutions on this one how we can minimize all the the pollution by advancing the combustion engine itself Euro 6 or maybe it’s a better Euro in the Futures I don’t know okay thank you thank you very much Papa

Johannes for the incredible Insight on that subject and still we talk about confidence uh Miss Huang um on the EVS developments and that the push for the ecosystem even though e-visa emit less emission we all know that it still gets its energy from fossil energy and that undoubtedly that

Condition lacks a conviction for many of us who think oh it’s actually a Greener solution but in return in reality is that it still actually still makes use of fossil energy so what do you think should be the uh challenge that should be addressed on this issue

Okay so I think in one of the presentations earlier someone commented that Indonesia is selling two gigawatt of solar power to Singapore now if Indonesia can export the power I’m pretty sure Indonesia can generate enough clean energy for your own self-consumption so I think um this journey and rightly pointed out

Right by one of our panelists that you need a mixture of solution so as we solve part of it using electric vehicle and I’ll be more specific battery electric vehicle because there are three tails of it we would also be working on the clean energy generation front whether it’s a

Solar or Joe thermal or micro hydropower in Indonesia maybe by the time hydrogen production will also catch up such that Indonesian with your large landmass you are able to produce excessive solar that maybe you don’t need to use it at a time and it can be

Stored in the form of hydrogen and this hydrogen can then be used in clean transportation in the form of a hydrogen fuel cells yes that’s definitely a possibility or other things right and of course we don’t discount the biomass potential too it’s the endless possibility for clean energy

Thank you very much uh Miss Huang and uh Miss Huang still on with you on the how do you think has the advancements of evisa battery especially how it impacts on its range and its performance and what developments do you think we can expect in this future and uh on the

Advancements of a battery for EVS and its range and performance and this question I would like to ask both to Dr Mitchell and Miss Huang all right so for battery um Innovations right in the past um five to ten years it has improved tremendously which is why you saw the

Drop in the pricing and what are some of this more technical Improvement that we see is in um nmc they use also sorry nmc stands for nickel magnesium and Cobalt and the amount of minerals needed to produce the same amount of energy has dropped tremendously take for example the Tesla battery

Few years ago they probably need eight times more than what they need to use today and I’m sure this ratio continuously improves the other very good uh Improvement is the lithium phosphate battery which in short we call the lfp so it’s a pioneered more by the

Chinese side and it has even worn over Tesla that those that are manufactured in China uses the lfp model so this is a lot safer they are very unlikely to catch fire and I think the next Frontier for batteries um would be the solid state battery

Right now it is still in the r d phase will be very exciting to see getting commercialized it hasn’t been why I do you got a sodium battery Factory already producing I think so yeah um moniker is quite right the cost of batteries is just dropping tremendously

And the the more that the cost drops the more ubiquitous they become the more the cheaper the vehicle comes hence more people buy them this is called rights law and for every doubling of production you get a certain percentage drop it’s called the learning curve but the other side of that is

That it’s not just the physical chemical battery performance it’s the it’s the way in which the car uses that battery and that’s all software and you know the software is getting both the battery management system that protects the battery and increases longevity and also the way in which the

The software takes energy out of the battery when you accelerate and it just you know we’re just getting massive improvements in the efficiency of um the way the car uses energy in terms of kilometers per watt hour as I as I said in the presentation

So what you have is you once you buy a car you’ve bought your battery at the price but the software updates will keep improving your range efficiency so we’ve already seen that Teslas get a range increase because somebody updated the software not because they got a different battery and we’ll also see

That in the longevity of the batteries and that will go to cost all right thank you very much Dr Mitchell and uh ladies and gentlemen and now I’d like to direct the floor uh the questions to the floor for those of you who have any questions please do not

Hesitate to just rest your hands and then our organizers are going to hand over the mic to you so if there’s anyone ah yes I see someone okay and the next to IBU yes good afternoon all panelists my name is Tito I come from um my question will be uh we noticed

That in 2020 there is a ban over nickel or export from Indonesia so therefore uh since 2020 up until now there are so many new nickel smelters that are established in Indonesia but one thing uh that we noted from Nichols smelters that they are not of course they are not

Producing EV batteries directly they produced either nickel mate or nickel sulfate those two are the intermediaries product to create uh EV battery and they are exposed to a commodity Market uh commodity commodity market price which cannot be dictated by the uh which is dictated by the global price

So the long-term solution for this situation is to create an EV battery industry Industries in the home countries in Indonesia and as in the banking Industries and the backing sectors we are more than willing to providing financing for these new Industries however with the new industry uh it is a Greenfield industries that

Have inherent risk it’s a new Industries and as a bank we have to be prudent so my question uh to maybe pass one day or to all panelists I would like to I would like to have your views on how a bank can provide financing for this new

Upcoming Industries which is the EV batteries manufacturers while at the same time being prudent and able to mitigate risk very well that will be the uh my question thank you very much thank you very much for the great great question and I guess we’ll start with you

Yeah well um that’s a good positive comments on the nickel um producing as we have the resources here we have the raw materials we produce nickels now with the smelters there have been a lot of discussions on how going forward that the government needs to do as you all understand that

Today we export the nickels and the battery is made out of the other countries and then we imported that back again and there have been a lot of discussion which I’ve heard that that the governments are discussing and and actually talking about on how we produce the battery itself and after producing

It probably we can then producing a an automotive on our own because you know you know we just now we heard about the the person is actually this one Baba over there is actually a electric vehicles producers you know who knows that we can produce even electric uh

Vehicles cars and motorcycles in our own country and and by then like what Johannes is talking about is discussing just now that we can reduce the price well first of all is reducing the price and maybe there will be a new model but a new model of selling the cars like you

Know what Vietnam has done they actually producing electric vehicles and then they sell it to the us but they don’t sell the full Lock Stock and Barrel with the battery and and the body itself but the the battery itself and they rent it out

This is what I heard and and a lot of business model going forward like like but Johannes nango is talking about there might be a lot of things changed going out in you know going in the Futures the business model and then we talk about on how we secure our

Financings right but you’re talking about onto insecure of financings then talking about securing our financing is definitely we talk about assessing the clients assessing the new debtors you know first and foremost I think we should thank ojka today I think by itself we can uh you know

Um kind of Select our dentists because we all now connected with sleep we used not to be connected with sleep now every application that comes to the finance company 50 of those are rejected because the Slicks are bad so with that situation and conditions that we now can understand the profile

Of the debtors because we used not to be able in a finance company when someone is actually defaulted he can then go to the other Finance Company get financing but now it’s all connected and ojka is working hard today not only on our side of the financing side but also on the

Fintage the financial technology the the P2P lenders lending companies also going to be in the Sleek uh uh uh members you know and when everythings are connected we will definitely can reduce the risk of having bad customers and then talking about the the car itself you know the the

Motorcycles and the car again I think that we need to also make an ecosystem you know about the the used cars and the used motorcycle would that will there be any uh Traders or any you know used car vehicles and motorcycles that will be

Able to take the parts of of use one and then sell it and who knows at one point in time the battery itself will not die it can inject certain things by changing the cells oddly and then it’ll continue forever and ever without even going like we discussed about the dead battery but

The battery itself will continue to be alive who knows I don’t know but I hope they’ll answer the questions thank you very much Baba Johannes represent ing Aikido would like to uh maybe input on that subject for me basically uh I don’t have any idea you know what the battery itself

You know because I’m not playing on that one but what I heard is actually penology is still being developed might be in the future they will they will make battery without the one that actually we know right now for example nickel whatevers you know there can be change okay so uh

I don’t know about the banking business but I know about the the car manufacturing business and in my opinions actually against that the combustion engine is already maximum the the technology but for the battery electric vehicle the technology is still very immature you know they’re still going to be

Improving the Futures so at this moment peoples are very exciting about the electric vehicle and the battery must be coming from the nickel Cobalt anything but we don’t know yet what have going to be happening in the Futures so don’t ask me about that one maybe you can ask to

The to the component industry which is actually very concentrating things in the uh battery electric vehicles thank you very much Baba and if you would like to uh have another yes thank you I’m dini from Bang bdbn my question is to Monica ibumonica and also pass 1D so my question is still

Connected with the uh the guys from CIMB so this is related to the risk of a financial industry in financing the motorcycle so as you know that in Indonesia some sometimes the naughty customer when we repossessed their asset they will cannibalize all the part of the motorcycle so my question is EV

Finance the motorcycle with EV and then they took the battery out then that’s the end of the game I think we cannot sell out right sell the the the motorcycle through the auction or Private Sales so how to secure this position of the financial industry that’s my first

Question the second question to miss Monica in related to the terms condition of the financing so do we need to adjust our term condition with the lifetime of the battery because there will be variety of battery with a lifetime of the battery itself thank you thank you very much Ebu what a great

Interesting question touching the base the touching the base on that subject and uh I know you’re eager to answer this question the time is yours again I think there are a lot of financial players here’s the the concerns as as I already sort of delivered the message it’s all about the

Qualities about the um default customers about naughty customers like what you’re saying and that is why I think that they need there will be a lot of calculation needs to be done by us as a financial players today when we finance a conditions cars or engine cars and motorcycles the cars

Financing maybe can last up to five to six years financing book but maybe with this electric vehicles who will start again with only one two or three years Max financings because at the end of the day after three years there’s still sort of values of the car itself right

Because you know the the guarantee of the battery maybe can last for eight years so at the end of the day there is one or two period of recycle but again I think going back the residual values of the cars who knows there’ll be a new technology that the battery will not

Will not end by itself there’ll be a change of the sales only you buy and then and I don’t know to be honest today we are all still waiting on the on sort of what sort what would be the right concept for us to do the financings as as

I’ve seen a lot in uh on the street as well I’ve spoken with with the grab drivers of the motorcycles now we have this motorcycle called swap swap the battery and I believe I think motorcycle maybe will move even faster than the car itself I agree with you how we protect the battery

That it goes back to the insurance company because we will then transfer the risk to the insurance company that is that is why until today boo the insurance company has not released what would be the insurance premium because they have got no experience in trying to solve these issues about

And and I don’t know in terms of protecting the battery itself maybe there’ll be also a technology that if the battery is stolen maybe the battery itself cannot run again by touching the the mobile I don’t know to be honest I mean everything is controlled by technology today but again

I don’t have the right answers on that but we need to go and and I don’t know maybe in the features battery motorcycle cannot be financed anymore it has to be buy through cash like we go back to the oldest cars and motorcycles needs to buy everything

Needs to bought to be bought by cash but as Market goes I think there will be a love and opportunity and all the questions that is actually arise by the public I think it has to be solved between us among all the players there will be times on that book I hope

That clarify the question your question okay um May I just check my understanding of the second question regarding the terms and coordination so when you’re asking if we have to vary the terms according to the type of batteries is that what you meant okay follow the lifetime of the battery all right

So thanks for clarifying so I’m glad that this word technology has been brought up so unlike the combustion engine whereby it’s more straightforward actually the battery itself has a lot of data to it and the battery management system the BMS itself is a mandatory component inside the battery of the car

Or the motorbike so instead of you know caring about what type of battery what chemistry it is who manufacture it and so forth it may be more um it could be interesting I also do not know the answer to this question that the the financial gets some form of assurance by having

Access to those data points over the lifetime of the the lease or the financing so you could set certain criteria right so such as did the battery degrade too fast or did they get into an accident then in this case they may suffer some penalty or the the lease

Gets affected the premium gets adjusted and all that so I would say that um the the creativity on your terms and condition uh has to be further explored uh explored I I I heard I’m not entirely sure but apparently in Germany there are this startup insurers or capitalizing company

They are making use of this battery data to determine the oh the price that they would lease it at or what is the price of the insurance premium so maybe those are food for thought thank you very much and miss Monica Huang and if there’s anyone else who

Would like to ask questions we are asked Yes Papa I see two I will go with uh yes papa in the middle and then afterwards the one on the right thank you good afternoon my name is Indonesia Monica and David mentioned about the five percent rule when you

Have five percent the market then the the sales will Spike but listen to Johannes I’m don’t fool that initial follow that path uh what do you think by David and Monica will we have long tail for Indonesia or obviously four or five percent rules and I have very different views of the future

I don’t see why Indonesia would be different from anywhere else it’s a tsunami the market doesn’t care about the existing structure it will change okay well I mean that answers it all right so please do not treat the five percent as an exact science or the Tipping Point

Every country has their own some like the us if I remember the statistics correctly they were hovering at six percent for a few years and it didn’t grow until recently it went back up again and I suspect that was driven by policy and Investments so we will find

Out in a few years time maybe we have another um get invited the ojk for our bandwidth we’ll see what’s the result yeah thank you very much Monica and Dr Mitchell and uh yes we like to ask Baba on the back to please uh we would have

The organizer to hand over the mic to you thank you uh thank you good afternoon my name is algon I am from UD Astra motor Indonesia uh as a conference conventional vehicle user not yet electric vehicle probably the vehicle is an asset if the future policy requires electric vehicle

What will the status of the conventional vehicle be won’t become unused vehicle and become a big clause thank you thank you very much could you maybe explain on honor to whom the question is directed to um it’s actually for policy from uh for gay Kindle probably no okay yes thank you ah

Again to you one more time is actually your question because I get confused on these ones you know what will the status of the conventional vehicle be if electric vehicle is is a must is required for the future uh it’s become a news vehicle and become a big

Loss for an asset okay in that one basically I already make the presentations that I still believe that in the future there will be no single Solutions you know yeah what I mean by single Solutions are you assuming that Indonesia combustion engine will will not be allowed anymore to sell in

Indonesia and cannot be used in Indonesia I don’t think it actually will be that easy second one is actually then you’re talking about that the only thing that can run in Indonesia is actually a battery electric vehicle why must be battery why not Hitler again why not the biofuels we don’t know yet

So I don’t think that the government will that be easy to make the decision like as fast as that without considering all those things you have to consider Indonesia is a very big country we are number uh the fourth biggest population in the world and our country is very big and to

To move from Indonesia from for example from Jaffa Island to Sumatra to Bali is a very long distance you know okay so is that means that basically the battery electric vehicle will be the answer on that one even the advanced country cannot answer the one if I can

Asking for example is Singapore already make the policy that by when that Singapore will not allow combustion engines uh going to be sell or running in in Singapore anymore is there any rule on that one yes the Singapore government has said that by 2030 there will be no more sales of combustion cars

But they still can use the combustion so even Singapore a small country uh they already make the decision 2030 no more new selling combustion engine but the combustion engine that already sold in Singapore still can be used okay Indonesia is different don’t forget one things we are still producing gasoline

We are still producing the palm oil we are the producers of the Cars 3 hikers in the in the world and then our Market is very big I’m afraid that basically if Indonesia doing things like like Singapore then the conversion engine car will be exported to Indonesia if we stop all the

Production in Indonesia okay so uh I still believe we are still working I’m working very close with the ministry of industrial there are more than 1.5 million people working in this industry and then we have the bio technology here as well for the uh B

2035 they’re going to be b40 and b50 in the Futures and the palm oil industry is still there so Indonesia I think won’t be that easy to go and stop all the combustion engine uh as I mentioned as well before for the military vehicle are you sure that you

Are not going to use the combustion engine you’re going to use the the battery electric vehicle military vehicle maybe yes in Singapore but not in Indonesia you go to the Jungle in Papua or in kalimantan You’re Gone without that one so it’s not that easy okay thank you

Thank you very much Baba Johannes and if there’s anyone else who would like to ask questions oh okay I see one right there uh we’d like to kindly ask our organizer to hand over the mic to the gentleman wearing the white shirt the one wearing the white shirt yes check good afternoon

My name is Adrian sirigar I’m from ojk development Insurance guarantee and pension fund now we call it Pepe Depot more than a decade ago I started my career in petrochemical Industry what I’ve learned from that experience with a relatively limited Capital even with foreign investment Indonesia may need to

Choose from which we develop our strength and value proposition in the context of electric vehicle a value chain which one you believe will be more valuable to invest in Upstream capabilities more so around infrastructure or more towards Downstream focusing on the retail Market uh and why thank you

Thank you papa and is this question are directed to Baba suwandi right a democratic question here we go so uh I guess we can start with um maybe Dr Mitchell or Miss Wong first yeah thanks um if I look at Indonesia it’s uh it’s a large country it’s got a large population

Uh and it’s uh developed it’s moving from a developed country or a developing country to a developed country and one of the things that we know about countries that move in that direction is that they move from you know agrarian Agriculture and Manufacturing to services

And so I would say that if you’re going to invest I would invest in the downstream in the retail part not in the Upstream in the commodity part your your future is in your human capital not in your natural resources okay very thank you very much and uh I

Was also informed by organizers that are some of the questions would also be directed from our audience uh joining us online and um okay I guess we have not received those questions yet and they have not been projected on the screen okay um there’s no signal oh okay I’m guessing

Uh okay gentlemen if I end up Miss Huang if I could emphasize on this a very interesting point uh during our entire panel discussion is that there’s still several ironies that’s decorating the EV uh ecosystem here today and that is when it comes to insurance and how um oh okay

Let me let me continue with that question later and focus on the questions from our audience and we’ve already gotten the question from our audience uh joining us online and this question is from uh Desiree and from Mitsubishi Corp and this is to all speakers uh to all panelists with the

Current load demand and uncertain environments how would you convince businesses to start to contribute and enter the electric vehicles ecosystem given the significant initial Investments needed I guess uh this very question we’re going to have baba suwandi to uh answer the question well um again I think with all this

Uncertainty and as I mentioned to you that finance company will follow the path will follow the demand and I think to be wise this is a process of Transformations as we discussed about this combat combustion engine vehicles and then we’re going towards the electric vehicles we talk about sustainability we talk about clean

Environments again we just released this new law number four to 2023 in that new law number four 2023 we have one of the clause about the carbon offset and I think towards these Transformations where whereby we still use this engine based Vehicles we can contribute by um you know charging our customers and

Environmental surcharge fees and that fees will go through a certain fund and the fund will then offsetting you know whatever things that you polluted and then we build a new forest and I think that has been done by the overseas um like the airline industry airline industry is polluting and probably the

Polluting most of the pollution comes from the airline industry because they use gasoline Diesel and also being used by the Cosmetic products the Cosmetic that women are using you know using this you know CPO right that is also some things that contribute this is what I’ve heard

From a friend of mine who’s actually you know went to the US and ran a motorbikes in the motorbikes invoice it is stated environmental surcharge fees when I’m actually asking where does all those fees goes to and I guess probably in the US there’ll be a certain funds

Then it will be contributed to build the force again and that carbon offset I think ojeka is has will issue the new regulation on how will you know OJ car Capital Market will will then issue uh this um carbon offsets regulations on how we then come along with the whole

Situations as we transform into electric vehicles so with that uh smooth transitions from what we are doing today and moving towards electric vehicles as I mentioned we cannot going back it’s just we need to move forward and then create a new business model and I guess that would be probably the answers on

How we’re going forward um doing this transformation from the commissions moving forward using this carbon offset as the solutions and I think uh that would be probably one of the answers thank you very much Baba swandi and that well this uh next question is from Miss

Lydia directed to a miss Monica Huang on first on the prediction of EV population becoming bigger to uh ice and uh as the world moves towards Greener and more sustainable Transportation options electric car and hydrogen car has viable Alternatives as well so in the future which one will be more Greener will be

More green and uh battery electric or hydrogen fuel cells miss Monica okay so regarding the first questions I will probably take my own interpretation all right so if we’re talking about global EV population being bigger than the ice I would say that we have quite a long way to go so

Um the most obvious one would be the Africa continent how they would you know get electrified maybe they will look to Indonesia Thailand Vietnam as Role Models decades down the road so it the tsunami is coming but I don’t think they come in waves and we will

Take some time okay to the second question um whether the battery EV or the hydrogen fuel cells EV will be greener um so I would take the Liberty to change this question all right because they are both green and we will use them in different ways battery EV is limited today by the

Energy and power density which is why we keep talking about the driving range how you cannot reach from one end of Java Island to the other end of Java Island and so forth right so but battery EV is particularly good in shorter distances and those in a few hundred kilometers

Range of driving per day and hydrogen fuel cell they can be uh assumed that you have hydrogen uh stations along the major highways and so forth then they are excellent for the heavy duty Vehicles such as your trucks or your Prime movers and those large cranes in the pots

And potentially for your Marine vessels the the ships Aviation maybe not so much I have not heard too much of hydrogen fuel cells for them but these are all possibilities so think on applications not who is greener than who because we need a mixture of all

Thank you very much so these are oh and now um okay okay wonderful well I distinguished guest ladies and gentlemen as uh I will ask I’ll allow uh one more audience member to uh propose a question to our uh speakers if there’s anyone else yes

And um I’d like to ask maybe from our organizers if you could hand over the mic to The Madam sitting at the front thank you very much hello everyone my name is Lulu from Museum my question is quite easy actually uh this is one of the uh the two to attract

The customer is there any different pricing between uh uh electric vehicle and a non-alike vehicle for the End customer and then is there any all uh is there any benefit or any incentive from ojk our government for the bank or financing company that provide green financing and what kind of the incentive

Is it thank you thank you very much and IBU is this question directed to our Indonesian uh panelists yes I think uh uh is for parts only maybe okay wonderful Baba you’re very popular today time is yours this is talking about financings about the the risk of the quality of the portfolio but

I think as I understand uh ojika has sort of like issues letters or probably either OJ characters or even the the Surah um they have issued a refinance electric vehicles I think the attack I’m edible the atom air is probably considered to be incentivized on on that issues as far

As to my understanding for you in the bank I think that be one of the advantage but that is the main advantage of the atem the risk of the risk weighted average thank you very much Baba thank you so answer the questions and for the End customer is there any

Different pricing for Evie and non-ev yeah and for the motorcycles I think the government’s not ojeka has uh issued their letters as well to subsidize I mean from oh subsidize the you know if you would like to convert your engine motorcycles the price today is 15 million you only pay 7 million

You pay only eight million seven million is subsidized okay then your conversions of that motorcycles um the there is sort of like a pointed uh sort of uh what do you call the bank yeah the the service stations registered and certified book you can go to the certified and registered service

Stations to convert your engine commission’s motorcycles and then you only pay Seven uh eight million for that and you can get eight million through financing’s concept as well thank you thank you that has been built by the governments oh thank you thank you very much Ebu for the

Excellent question and thank you very much Baba swandi and at the singers cast ladies and gentlemen maybe uh for one more question I would like to direct this to a Dr uh David Mitchell and uh yes Dr David Mitchell this will be the last question and you will definitely be the uh the

Person that’s going to drop the anchor message to this yes a lot of pressure for Dr Mitchell and Dr Mitchell um seeing after listening to all the panelists and I speak about the uh talk about their presentations as well as the questions from our audience we realized

That um on saving the planet on the role of financial sector and especially on an ev’s development and ecosystem it is still being sprinkled by a just a couple of ironies for example on the um Insurance how it’s still going back and forth and how the um it says

That of course Evie um it emits less emissions but it also still gets its energy from energy from fuel fossil energy and one more thing is that when it comes to the concerns of a battery disposal as well as recycling how do you address those issues especially in terms

Of its Recycling and Disposal part no pressure Um I I think it’s important to understand where we are in the transition or disruption depending on how you think about this we’re right at the beginning especially in Indonesia we’re really right at the beginning so all of the licensing Insurance Finance the issue that somebody might steal the

Battery and then your asset is not there these are all things that will get worked out as more and more and more vehicles and bikes are sold you you don’t start an industry where the mature value chain you don’t start an industry knowing everything that that there is to know

And I think the important thing about starting this transition in Indonesia is that that you learn as you go along and you know that you will make mistakes and what you must do is recognize when you do and correct and you know in terms of recycling I think

Monica said it the best the recycling is already happening there is a substantial battery recycling industry that already is started with laptops and phones and in the car the cell production industry it’s it’s the I think up to 30 percent of of cells are not suitable for use and they

Just go straight back into the recycling so there’s already millions and millions of dollars worth of recycling that goes on just not at the retail level this is a going to be a pretty big Journey it’s going to be a challenging disruption and the people that it will be most

Challenging to are the incumbent industries that are likely to change and that includes financing but I think Park you said it the best you don’t really care what you finance so long as it’s there and and you will adapt your model to whatever the customer needs because at the end of the

Day they’re paying the money back thank you thank you very much ladies and gentlemen let us give the biggest run of Applause for our dearest panelists what an incredibly Illuminating Sensational session ladies and gentlemen and if I may uh wrap up a little bit on this uh very important subject uh ladies and

Gentlemen especially in its relations to Indonesia Indonesia as we all know is the fourth most populous country in the world where also the fourth largest uh the third largest democracy in the world the largest island nation in the world which makes distribution and Logistics not the easiest and we are also the

Largest economy in southeast Asia thriving Market ladies and gentlemen brimming with life and ASA Baba Johanna says also emphasize and stated on the fact that we are also amongst the world’s uh worst pollutions papaya which makes this role especially on this topic today on saving the planet on the role

Of financial sector support on carbon reduction as well as electric vehicles developments and ecosystem the more more important ladies and gentlemen and I would like to sincerely thank all of our dearest panelists for emphasizing the importance of transparency and focus especially with regards to this ecosystem of electric vehicles ladies

And gentlemen and indeed when there is good purpose there will be good profit thank you very much everyone for your great insights on The Illuminating session and I’d like to uh deliver the floor back to our emcee Miss Vera thank you Emilia okay I’m Elia and all the

Speakers please stay on stage and allow me to invite Mr agusuguerto head of ojk Institute please kindly to this stage for handing over souvenir to the speakers and moderators thank you Foreign Three two one once again three two one thank you all the speakers and moderators also Mr agus sugiarto and of course thank you for all ladies and gentlemen thank you all for your active participation in the afternoon session ladies and gentlemen moving on the next agenda allow me to invite Mr Gaffin

Forte from prospera and Mr karwayang from l i b f please kindly to the stage and Mrs Nino man puspani for handing over souvenir we are informing you that ojk prospera and libf have collaborated in today’s event okay take a group photo please three two one give the best smile once again

Three two one thank you and for Mrs Nino man puspany please stay on stage ladies and gentlemen as we near the conclusion of this enriching event it’s an honor for group hat of Financial Services Research in ojk Institute to deliver a wrap up and closing remarks Mrs nyoman puspani please proceed with

The closing remarks thank you your Excellency Deputy Commissioner of the secretary Board of commissioner and Logistics maybe uh his uh outside because he’s meeting your Excellency the head of ojika Institute is an Excellency uh all participants who still attending and stay start from in the morning until uh at the moment

All distinguished guests and speakers foreign good afternoon I’m very happy today because uh what vagus mentioned this morning the dream becomes true because two years ago the initiation of uh we have the journal is already launched this morning and I’m honored to address all of you at the first ojeka International Research Forum

And the loans of the international Journal of financial systems this event is remarkable Milestone providing a platform for us to confirm to share knowledge and Foster collaboration within the realm of financial services I extend my sincere gratitude to emmancia and paragus and also for the team in ojika Institute and uh

As well as our esteem partner prospera the London Institute of banking and finance and the CPA Australia their dedication exemplates or the case commitment to advancing knowledge and promoting their love in the Global Financial landscape throughout this event we have been pretty two enlightening presentation from leading expert in the field of

Sustainable Finance they have underscored the urgent need to combat climate change and accelerate sustainable transport Transportation solution the Intensive and insightful discussion have seed light on the challenges and promising opportunities facing the Global Financial system in this effort evolving area of environmental consciousness today also must inauguration the international Journal of financial

Systems this platform will serve as a repository of cutting-edge research and Innovative thinking in the field of financing systems I wish to acknowledge all contributors researchers outdoors and reviewers who have dedicated themselves to ensuring the quality of relevance and every article within this journal this collaborative Spirit formed the foundation

For Global Financial progress ladies and gentlemen I have the pleasure to share some exciting news today we have dedicated that uh this conference as an annual tradition we eagerly anticipate each year this forum will reconvene the discuss the latest development in the Global Financial systems fortify our collaborative Network and Pioneer Innovations

For a more inclusive and robust financial future furthermore the international Journal of financial systems will continue to provide a platform for high quality articles I am delighted to announce that this journal will be published twice a year specifically in June and December this presents an opportunity for researcher practitioners and policy maker to

Continue expressing their best idea in advancing the Global Financial system last but last but certainly not least on behalf of the committee I would like to take a moment to extend my sincere apologize if there have been any aspects of this event that might not meet your expectations or if any inconvenience was

Experienced your feedback is infallible and we are committed to continuously improving in and refining our efforts for the next event we look forward to your participant in the future thank you for your attention my we meet again in a spirit of enthusiasm in the year to come [Applause]

Thank you Mrs Pani for your valuable costing remarks ladies and gentlemen we are the closing remarks by Mrs Nino man puspani as for group health of Financial Services Research in ojk Institute we have come to the end of the Indonesia’s research firm 2023 so ladies and gentlemen truly we doubt

Your support this event would not be possible please give big round of applause for all of us we would like to inform as a requirement to get e-certificate please make sure that all participants online and offline feel and submit the feedback form that available on the front screen and chat box

Also you may visit the mini site of ojk Institute to download all materials from speakers on September the 26 2023 please complete the form before the webinar is Ended as a requirement to get e-certificate of attendance for today’s webinar we extend our heartfelt thanks to all the distinguished speakers panelists

Moderators and participants who contribute to the success of this event let us continue to work together towards a brighter and more sustainable future we look forward to seeing you at future events thank you All right Foreign okay Foreign Okay

Sobat OJK, dalam rangka mendukung program pemerintah terkait pengurangan karbon dan pengembangan kendaraan listrik, OJK mengadakan Webinar The 1st OJK International Research Forum 2023 dengan tema “Save The Planet: The Role of Financial Sector to Support Carbon Reduction and Electric Vehicle Development” bersama Ketua Dewan Komisioner OJK Mahendra Siregar dan Wakil Ketua Dewan Komisioner OJK Mirza Adityaswara serta narasumber lainnya pada:

🗒️Senin, 25 September 2023
⏰Pukul : 09.00-16.00 WIB

Untuk registrasi dan informasi lebih lanjut dapat diakses melalui bit.ly/OJKInternationalResearchForum
Sobat juga bisa saksikan live streaming di youtube Otoritas Jasa Keuangan (OJK TV).

Catat tanggalnya dan jangan lupa ajak temanmu juga ya 😊

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